Inkwell: Authors and Artists

    
"It seems like the reason there aren't women in the public eye who are
happy about whatever weight they are is because the public eye doesn't
look favorably on them. Lori, what do you think about that? You worked
in film and tv."

Molly - I wrote about my experiences working in Hollywood with
don't-breathe-or-I-might-blow-over actresses, given my own history with
an eating disorder at age 11, for, of all things, a "woman's magazine"
(to be published later this year).  

The irony of that aside (it'll probably appear scrunched between an ad
page featuring a bikini-clad skeletal-like model and one for diet
pills), here's a little reality check.  Actresses who gain five pounds
are summarily dismissed as candidates for film/TV roles (unless they
want to be the asexual sidekick); female executives behind-the-scenes
are summarily dismissed for jobs (that have nothing to do with physical
appearance in terms of job description) if they don't have "Hollywood"
bodies.  Actresses drink Diet Coke for meals (meaning, THAT's the
meal); they work out several hours per day with a trainer; plastic
surgery is the norm, not the exception.

Glamorous?  I don't think so.  I wonder if people would idolize
celebrities' lives if they knew what these lives were REALLY like.

And Molly's right - because of the media culture, women in the public
eye can't be happy about their weight unless it's an abnormally low
number.  Anyone who tries to rock the boat is, as I said above,
summarily dismissed.  Cheery, huh?
  

    
I have a confession to make.  Now that I'm starting to get to "know"
all of you, I feel like I can say this and not crawl under a rock and
die of embarrassment or fall into a dangerous shame spiral.  I'm... how
should I say this... I guess I'm what you might call
technologically-challenged.  I mean, I can do medical school and teach
Calculus, but I swear, I have no idea how all of you hot-shots are
copying text from other people's messages and making them appear as
hyperlinks (or at least that cool blue color, which I assume is a
hyperlink).  Anyone able to give me a hint, here?  I know, I know, I'm
SO 1995.

I went to RadioShack today to get a gismo so I can tape interviews
through the phone for an article I'm working on, and the poor guy at
the store had to sit there and explain the thing to me, step by step. 
He must have thought I was a moron or a female version of the Lenny,
but fortunately, he had the patience of Mother Teresa and technological
know-how of... I guess a normal person.  Which worked out well for me.
 I came home, hooked it up, and it WORKS!  Woo-hoo!  Now if I can just
figure out speed dial on my cell phone...

Oh, the reason I mention the tape recorder gismo is that when I heard
my voice on playback, I didn't like the way my voice sounded.  I
sounded so much younger than I am, and I guess I sort of hoped I'd
sound more like Katherine Hepburn (when she was my age, not now!). 
More, I dunno, "womanly" and provocative.  So is that, like, anorexia
of the voice?  Being critical of what is, in a rational world, a
perfectly normal and acceptable aspect of oneself that you want to
change to meet some media ideal - be it voice, thighs, or buttocks?
  

    
Crow - on workplaces in which women DON'T bond over diets/food:

I like to say that the key difference between Hollywood and medicine
is that in medical school first year, we wore scrubs everyday and never
asked our colleagues if we looked thinner in the ones with the
drawstrings or those with the plastic waistbands.
  

    
"Now my friends and I talk not so much about wanting to be thin,
although many of my friends are thin, but more about the act of eating
as it becomes destructive, as in: 'pick up the phone or I'm going to
eat a cheesecake, I'm so upset.'"

Ruth - but don't you think that whether it's undereating or
overeating, it's still destructive if you can't control what you're
doing (avoidance or binging being flip sides of a similar internal
dynamic)?  

I guess my utopia would be a place where we didn't BATTLE with food
all the time.  We always seem to be fighting against an impulse, or
against food itself.

Wouldn't it be great if food served as pleasure and a source of
nourishment and not as an energy drain each time we sit down to a meal?
 I guess that, for me, has been one of the positive outcomes of having
had anorexia as a preteen (still:  hey kids, DON'T try this at home!).
 I decided not to live my life that way, and I think I'm a lot happier
for it, at least when it comes to food.  
  

    
I agree with Gail and Ruth - I feel like I'm in chemistry lab when I
walk into a nail salon.  Isn't it just a little bit sick that women put
acetone - a known carcinogen - on their nails, as part of a weekly
RITUAL?  Sheesh...

The odd thing about pedicures, in particular, is that during summer,
when people wear open-toe sandals a lot, almost everyone I see has had
a pedicure.  And I don't mean the kind of pedicure that's months old. 
I mean, a FRESH pedicure.  I got my first pedicure in about ten years a
few weeks ago while I was in L.A. (long story on WHY).  My act of
rebellion was to get a funky blue color, and I have to admit, the foot
massage part was luscious, but I can't imagine spending all that time
and money each week or even every two weeks or once a month to have my
nails painted.  

The downside is I'm lazy about cutting my toenails so I have to buy
new socks a lot, but at least sock shopping doesn't involve acetone. 
And hey - the scissors and stuff they use on your cuticles?  People
bleed, and washing them in hot water and soap isn't gonna keep you from
getting some pretty nasty viruses - like hepatitis or HIV.  So if the
cancer doesn't scare you, that lil' tidbit should...

But the thing is, I notice that when I wear sandals during the summer,
women LOOK at my toenails, and I can read the look on their faces. 
It's like, I'm gauche or unsophisticated or NAKED ("Can you please put
some POLISH on those toenails!") or something.  I used to play piano
and I even used that as an excuse to say to people, "Oh (giggle,
giggle), I can't get my nails done.  Piano."  Sometimes I  felt that I
needed an excuse.  Maybe it's a California thing.

Personally, I'm with Ruth - put me in a hot bubble bath, turn on some
Ani DiFranco or Carole King (I don't know whassup with me and Carole
King, but she's my bathing music), gimme a book, and that's what I call
"me-time."
  

    
Oh, and massages!  If I ever thought about committing suicide,
massages would be the thing that would make me think twice.  I'm with
Gail on that.
  

    
Kelly - Thanks for the ad hoc male focus group. Is either of those
guys single? :)

What those men said about women who feel good about their bodies as
being attractive - that's the feedback I get in the letters men write
me after reading STICK FIGURE.  

Self-confidence about one's body (for a woman, especially) seems to be
such a turn-on.  It's sort of the "highest order" or self-confidence
because many women feel confident nowadays about their talent,
intellect, creativity, etc., but rare is the woman who can say, "I love
my body."  Especially when, if that body were put in a police lineup,
it would never be mistaken for Cindy Crawford's.
  

    
"I just have this feeling that woman (and men) haven't changed much
and if there are any differences between now and then, they are only to
the degree that technology may have created new avenues for obsession,
and the media makes us more aware of how others look and how,
therefore, it might be possible for us to look,too."

Linda - PRECISELY.  I'm sure Ben's wife asked, many a time, "Honey, do
I look fat in this frock?"

btw, I found myself asking Ben something today, and I thought, "Where
did THAT come from?"  Then I remembered, and it's kind of helpful,
actually, to step out of your own world for a second.  Really puts
current "crises" in perspective.  
  

    

Yes, exactly.  It  helps me put perspective on things.  Thanks for that.

In my opinion, you are not technologically challenged.  You were able to
sign up for your account and immediately add a conference to your list, go
to a conference, and access a retired topic.  You have no idea how
advanced this stuff is for someone who has been here a grand total of
what, a week and a half?  Give yourself some credit, please!  

That's a good question about how to get the little >> marks in front of a
post.  Anybody know how to do that in Engaged?  I've been here going on
ten years and I don't know how to do that!
  

    
        Hell, neither do I, and I've been on here since I was a teenager. 
From what I've seen in movies, all humans under 18 have an intuitive
grasp of computers that allows them to crack CIA encryption with ten
keystrokes, so I guess quoting in Engaged is _really_ hard.
        Incidentally, women in Ben Franklin's time painted their faces with
white lead to appear paler.  It killed more than a few of them.  The
symmetry with the tanning issues folks mentioned above amuses me.
        As to what men _really_ want physically, I can only speak with total
confidence for myself, but (physically, of course) I like pale
brunettes or redheads with round faces and glasses.  Freckles a plus. 
Freckles on shoulders and back a _big_ plus.  And then, of course,
there's the derriere issue, but that's a rant (or a rave?) of its own,
and I don't want to get too specific here in inkwell.vue for all the
world to see. ;-)
        This is, of course, all fairly moot, as like anyone with an IQ higher
than George W. Bush, I _actually_ respond to personality and
intellect.  I've had great relationships with women I wouldn't have
looked twice at in the street, based on mutual interests and good
conversation and all that, you know, human interaction stuff. 
Likewise, I've had to beat more than one hasty social retreat after
initiating a conversation with some likely-looking lass only to realize
"Dear lord, she's dumber than a barrel of mud."  It really does make
one wonder why, when all of us smart folks will nod and say good
heavens yes of _course_ it's personality that matters, we all (myself
included) still spend so damn much time and money worrying about how we
look.  Are we hypocrites?  Are we willing to be hypocrites as long as
we're attractive and well-dressed hypocrites?  Am I overthinking again?
  

    
Lori, re: ... but don't you think that whether it's undereating or
overeating, it's still destructive if you can't control what you're
doing (avoidance or binging being flip sides of a similar internal
dynamic)?

I guess what I'm saying is that my friends are controlling it. Instead
of actually doing the destructive eating, they're reaching out,
getting help, connecting with another human being. I think it would be
fine if food were, to all of us, a nourishing substance with no
attached meaning or values, but right now I have maybe two friends for
whom that is the case. 
  

    
(FYI you can always insert angle brackets manually to signify a quote from
a previous message, but the angle bracket thing is just an email
convention that some of us are into, but what the heck - why not use
quotation marks?)
  

    
Lori, I'm really enjoying reading your posts even though I haven't posted
here.  I hope you'll stay on the Well after your interview is over.
  

    
Following up on <streak>'s hyperthoughts ("As to what men _really_ want
physically")... I can't find any consistency in my own thinking about
physical attributes. I do consistently find women of the silicon
persuasion unattractive, but somebody must be into plastic, because the
implant business seems to be a growth industry (no pun intended).

Actually, there is one physical attribute that seems to make a difference
to me, and I don't think you've mentioned it here. It has nothing to do
with weight.

I think I'm into *eyes*.
  

    

The day I stopped giving a damn what men do or don't find attractive and
just got with enjoying my own life, that was the day five thousand men fell
madly in love with me. Go figure.
  

    

Just a point of info -- good nail technicians always sterilize their
equipment between clients. I don't think there's anything wrong with
women pampering themselves with beauty services, as long as it's not
some kind of obsession.

A link offered from Clean Sheets, a review of a new erotic anthology called
"Zaftig: Well-Rounded Erotica," written by a man who adores fat women.
 http://www.cleansheets.com/reviews/book_06.13.01.shtml
  

    
I'm fuzzy on the details, but there was a study a while back which had men
look at a couple of sillhouettes of women's bodies, and they overwhelmingly
chose the Jeaneane Garofolo-like one rather than the Uma Thurman-like one.
  

    

Lori, you asked about making hyperlinks.   a URL will make a link if it
starts with h t t p or with w w w ... just type it in, thus:
http://www.well.com/tools.html
To link to another post around the WELL...  in the same topic, like this one
you just put the post number in angle brackets...   <127> is where you asked
about links above.   If I want to link to another conference, topic, and or
post number, for people with WELL passwords to go to, I'd use    <plumage.>
for example, for the very WELLish style, fashion and adornment conference.
Also, if you put brackets around a user name, without that trailing period
you see after plumage above, you get a link to the biographical info
provided by a member of the WELL, again, visiable to anyone with a password.
Like <leroy> for example.  There are a couple of ways people insert
brackets, either using the older UNIX editor commands with the PicoSpan
interface rather than in Engaged on the Web, or possibly with their telnet
application or even browser or desktop text editor.  You can even do it with
a word processor, but most folks would not bother.  Other conventions work
fine, like pasting a quote after saying who it is from, like...

<jonl> posted:

 I think I'm into *eyes*.

to which I have to say Oh Yeah. 
  

    
I'm enjoying this discussion even if I haven't organized my thoughts enough
to contribute anything.
  

    
N - I love your description of an attractive woman (your "type")
because it so completely flies in the face of media stereotypes of
what's "attractive."  And yet, reading your description, I pictured a
woman who looks like that and thought, "She sounds LOVELY."  In a real
way.  I could see how men could find a woman who fits that description
to be attractive/beautiful.  Whereas the woman who looks like that
probably believes she's unattractive because she doesn't resemble(name
of this week's media "It" girl).  

A "round face" is something a woman never wants to hear in a
description by a man, and yet you're saying that you find this
attractive.  Now, if only I knew a round-faced red-head with freckles
and glasses (I won't touch the derriere issue).  I'd definitely send
her your way!  
  

    
N- No, we're not hypocrites.  We spend so much energy trying to look
good despite our belief that personality, smarts, soul, etc. are key
because often in our culture, you don't "pass go" unless you look
attractive.  Meaning, you'll be passed over and no one will find out
how fabulous you are because the attractive people are spoken to first.
 Just go to a bar or a party of strangers.

I was very aware of this from a young age - it's all in my book.  And
I'm amazed that young girls are picking up on this so early, but it
does explain the sudden obsession with looks at that age.
  

    
Ruth - I agree.  Point taken!

Jon - yes, eyes!  And I don't mean physical appearance of eyes (i.e.,
color) so much as "life" or "passion" in the eyes.  One medical school
friend said he decided to become an ophthalmologist because "the eyes
are the most expressive organ."  Clinical, but true.
  

    
"Lori, I'm really enjoying reading your posts even though I haven't
posted here.  I hope you'll stay on the Well after your interview is
over."

Notice I'm using good ol' fashioned quotation marks, per Jon!

Autumn - It's almost 1 a.m. and here I am.  Very addicting. You'll
definitely see me here...bummer is, I just splurged and got HBO and now
I'm thinking, "When will I have time to watch AND check out the WELL?"
Maybe I should cancel HBO?
  

    
"The day I stopped giving a damn what men do or don't find attractive
and just got with enjoying my own life, that was the day five thousand
men fell madly in love with me. Go figure."

Leda - So, if I stop looking for my keys and caring where they are,
they'll turn up? 

No, seriously, it's no coincidence that when you stopped worrying
about appearance men flocked to you.  Men have told me (am I boring all
of you by repeating something I said earlier?) that self-confidence is
what they find most attractive in women. Not ego or arrogance but
genuine comfort with one's body and being.  And I find that SO
attractive in men, too.  Again, big difference between ego and
confidence.
  

    
Susannah - You're right on two counts:

(1) Most instruments ARE sterilized, but you'd be surprised.  (I'm
sort of an ambulance-chaser for health-related snafu stories b/c of med
school.)

(2) More important, I'm not a manicure Nazi. (Hope I'm not offending
anyone - I mean it like the Soup Nazi from "Seinfeld.")  If a woman
likes getting pedicures and manicures, great.  I guess I was ranting so
much I didn't make it clear that what I objected to was the time and
effort and obsession that can accompany these beauty rituals.  And
personally, pedicures don't "do it" for me.  But I can see why they
would for many folks.