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permalink #126 of 280: Chuck Charlton (chuck) Wed 4 Dec 02 22:28
permalink #126 of 280: Chuck Charlton (chuck) Wed 4 Dec 02 22:28
I'm reading this on the commute train on Wednesdays, and I sometimes get distracted, but I'm about a quarter of the way into it now. I was struck with the effect that affiliation with a virtual group often results in isolation from co-present others. We've seen various manifestations of this already. An early example was been the person on a landline phone at home for hours while ignoring family members. The next generation began answering calls on cell phones and engaging in disruptive conversations while in meetings or while dining with friends or co-workers. Now folks are playing with their Blackberries or other texting devices while participating in simultaneous interactions in another space. What strikes me is that each of the individual communication techniques involved are becoming less demanding of our immediate attention. We no longer need the degree of concentration necessary to conduct a two-way voice conversation with someone. We can multi-task, and text while talking. Are there indications of the limits of such multiple concurrent communication processes? My hunch is that fifteen-year-olds, as mentioned in the book, can interweave several simultaneous real-time conversations in different media. As a less youthful person, I guess I wonder about my continued ability to fully participate in the evolution of omnipresent communication environments. I also begin to question the importance of each of the individual interactions, and whether quantity will be the new "quality". I sound like an old fart.
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permalink #127 of 280: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) Thu 5 Dec 02 10:04
permalink #127 of 280: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) Thu 5 Dec 02 10:04
Women should be able to deal with this multitasking better, "studies have shown", for example: Women have a bridge that connects the right and left frontal lobes that is missing in the brain of men. THE RESULT: Women multitask better than men. Men focus better than women. Evolution gave us this difference because in the old days, women had to stir the pot, listen for predators and watch the children all at once while men went out to hunt, which required patience and focus. However, in our complex world, we need to be able to compensate for this difference as well as exploit it. http://www.outsmartyourbrain.com/brain_tools/tapes_tools/email_list/archive/me n_and_women_diff.html is the source of the above quote and has a lot of other tips on how to multitask in the way that Howard is talking about.
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permalink #128 of 280: Infradibulated Gratility (ssol) Thu 5 Dec 02 10:59
permalink #128 of 280: Infradibulated Gratility (ssol) Thu 5 Dec 02 10:59
Just for the sake of clarity and a little more precision, both men and women have a network of neurons in their brains called the Corpus Colosum (?) that connects the left and right lobes. Women TEND to have more robust connecting networks of neurons than men. Women TEND to "multitask" more ably than men. Individual men MAY be better able to focus on a single task. We're talking about a spectrum of tendencies when you get into the relationship of biology, neurology and the sexes (all ten or twelve of them ;-) Ooops... another topic!
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permalink #129 of 280: Brian Slesinsky (bslesins) Thu 5 Dec 02 11:43
permalink #129 of 280: Brian Slesinsky (bslesins) Thu 5 Dec 02 11:43
I have heard that on average, men are taller than women.
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permalink #130 of 280: Gail Williams (gail) Thu 5 Dec 02 12:12
permalink #130 of 280: Gail Williams (gail) Thu 5 Dec 02 12:12
And many men and women are non-average in various ways, of course. Examples are hardly necessary. (Though this may cause part of the Venus/Mars differentiation or crock of stereotypes, depending on how one fits into it.)
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permalink #131 of 280: Gail Williams (gail) Thu 5 Dec 02 12:15
permalink #131 of 280: Gail Williams (gail) Thu 5 Dec 02 12:15
(Excuse me please for bad use of "this" above: ssol's "more robust connecting networks" may cause part of the Venus/Mars dichotomy.)
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permalink #132 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Thu 5 Dec 02 12:33
permalink #132 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Thu 5 Dec 02 12:33
I do think there is an emerging and increasing fragmentation (or segmentation if you want to use a less value-laden term) of attitudes toward technology and practices like always-on communications or "continuous partial attention" due to multitasking, along age lines. How you feel about these practices can probably be most easily predicted by asking how old you are. Anybody notice today's announcement that a new joint venture, backed by ATT, IBM, and Intel, plans to roll out tens of thousands of WiFi hotspots, and that the CEO is -- Larry Brilliant? <http://www.smartmobs.com/archives/000423.html> And does everyone recall that the man in charge of the Total Information Awareness campaign is one of the most notorious cyberblunderers in history? <http://www.smartmobs.com/archives/000422.html> The pace of events in the smart mobs field is quickening. Does anybody see any strange irony in the fear that people now can choose their sources of information, rather than having it spooned out for them? Horrors! This will lead to people paying less attention to what Time-Warner-AOL or Newscorp have to sell us today!
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permalink #133 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Thu 5 Dec 02 15:25
permalink #133 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Thu 5 Dec 02 15:25
A ways back upstream was a mention of the way critical thinking about where new communication technologies take us (an activity I definitely approve) sometimes gets lost in this dreamy nostalgia for a community we once had, but lost. A tangential conversation in another virtual community elicited a quote from a friend of mine, Christopher London, who gave me permission to quote him here: There's been a nostalgia industry about bucolic rural america practically since it conception, what with Jefforson's extolling the virtues of the yeoman farmer, de Toqueville extolling the virtues of small town democracy. But it's particularly been an "industry" since Frederick Jackson Turner's famous 'end of the frontier' thesis became all the rage at the end of the 19th Century and america was said to have been domesticated. The recognition that the future of the US was not in the country but in the city with its industry, led to much hand wringing about the rural at the same time as it was ideologically constructed as the bastion a of pure and unvarnished american "soul." Of course, there's a lot of mythmaking going on in such circumstances. The people at the head of the Country Life Movement, while still extolling the virtues of rurality, also saw it being in need of modernization because, in short, the rural model had become decrepit and, especially for women, psychotic (see Danbom's great book The Resisted Revolution for read on this last bit). This mythmaking continues. Politicians love to go on about "the heartland" and "middle america", weighting these geographic indicators with the burden of moral correctness. Well, some of the highest rates of drug addiction and the biggest meth labs are to be found in "the heartland" and "middle america." So, yea, nostalgia is at the heart of the matter when it comes to talking about community.
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permalink #134 of 280: virtual community or butter? (bumbaugh) Thu 5 Dec 02 18:29
permalink #134 of 280: virtual community or butter? (bumbaugh) Thu 5 Dec 02 18:29
Nice observation, that. How much of longing expressed for no-longer-with-us virtual communities is that sort of nostalgia, do you think?
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permalink #135 of 280: Chloe Lewis (c-lewis-c) Thu 5 Dec 02 21:32
permalink #135 of 280: Chloe Lewis (c-lewis-c) Thu 5 Dec 02 21:32
Slightly different community-nostalgia: some community loss seems to have happened when it became more common for neighborhoods to contain only houses of similar age and size, so that the people in them tended to be more and more similar in age and wealth. Mobile-device zoning is likely to be an accident of cost.... isn't it? Could it be covenanted or legislated? This seems more important after reading several posts that regard *speech* as technology. (Ars, surely, not techne.) If we're accustomed to thinking of our bodies as technology, and some people always get the good stuff, then those people are the good stuff.
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permalink #136 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Fri 6 Dec 02 10:36
permalink #136 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Fri 6 Dec 02 10:36
So -- Dave, Tim, anyone else active in the WiFi world -- what do you think the impact of the ATT-IBM-Intel joint venture will have on the community wireless networking movement? It seems to me that it will kill it, which is not necessarily a bad thing if our cities are blanketed by inexpensive WiFi access very quickly.
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permalink #137 of 280: Jon Lebkowsky (jonl) Fri 6 Dec 02 16:34
permalink #137 of 280: Jon Lebkowsky (jonl) Fri 6 Dec 02 16:34
(I just want to thank Howard and Bruce, and everyone else who's dropped by, for the great discussion. We ask for a two week minimum, but continue as long as you like!)
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permalink #138 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Fri 6 Dec 02 19:17
permalink #138 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Fri 6 Dec 02 19:17
I was underwhelmed by the ATT-IBM-Intel announcement (maybe in part because I had a bad reaction when I saw that is was Larry Brilliant who was going to head it). But frankly I don't think it will have any impact at all. For starters it is all built around the fad idea of 'hot spots.' As IF the whole country is going to seek out hot spots to get connected. Wi-Fi permits individuals to connect up anywhere there is a 'community 802.11b cloud.' And they will go to where they want to go at the instant - check out CNN, read their e-mail, maybe - if that is thir taste (it sure isn't mine) - join a chat group briefly. In that regard the wi-fi radios, connected to laptops (or more likely PDAs) will/can be used just like cell phones. Whether or not the nearest hotel is a 'hot spot' will be irrelevant. Now the interesting issue is, to what extent will the 'community wireless networking' movement foster the creation of 'free access' clouds all over? Where the wi-fi connected person essentially gets free access to the Internet. Now I mull these things over because, as you may know, I am a small company (Old Colorado City Communications) in the Westside of Colorado Springs, where my offices of now 18 years (leased office space) are in the center of the Old Colorado City commercial district (about a three linear block area with 98 small commercial buildings) surrounded by about 6,000 households in the residential area. My business does several things (administering NSF grants in the wilderness is one of them) in including being both a neighborhood Wireless ISP (extending 128-256kbs wireless to businesses) and providing the only high speed access to offices INSIDE the building I am in. And am usually (though not at the moment) connected 3 miles downtown to my upstream provider Cable and Wireless by 5.8ghz wireless - essentially free for me from my premises to the radio in the office building downtown. (if I were Qwest T-1 it would cost me $1,200 a month) I also am connected up from my home and office-in home, 1/2 mile away by T-1 wireless. Free. With always-on radios already 5 years old, but still truckin. And I extended, as part of a project, T-1 radios from my office and network point to the Old Colorado City History Center and its Web site which has been up 5 years now. Giving the little society, and center, high speed connectivity, about 1/2 mile. The amount of bandwidth used by the public coming into the web site is so small I just give them free bandwidth to/through me. (again it would be $1,200 a month for them through Qwest. Now I *could* (and want to but I am pretty busy) provide a free 802.11b cloud over most of the 98 buildings in Old Colorado City commercial district. With a seperate SSID from my commercial customers, no encryption for the public (while my commercial customers have higher wep, and I will install radius authentication if hackers start screwing around). I can also put up an 802.11b omni on my roof, link the radio into my point to point (non Wi-Fi) T-1 wireless link to my office, and I could put another one on the History Center roof - cost maybe $200 total - and let one of my sons who lives further away do the same. And let anyone with a computer with wi-fi card in it access the world free. Knowing my systems better than anyone in the world, I know that the amount of bandwidth they would use would be so minor, that I can carry it along side my serious business traffic that it would not be worth measuring. Now I wouldn't care if Brilliant came to town and put a charge-card hot spot in the Antlers hotel downtown (2.5 miles away) or one in our largest resaurant in OCC. It wouldn't affect me in the least. Now as soon as (maybe I'll be inventing one under my next NSF grant) I get my hands on a bunch of end-user 'mesh' IP radios, that cost maybe $100 each, I might SELL them to the neighbors (and they would hop hop hop traffic), but give the bandwidth away free! And the whole side of town could progressively get connected! Free. Where I will be the only one out of pocket, and only for the 'added' bandwidth. Which is getting cheaper and cheaper. Hot Spots from AT&T? All that is is a reinvention of the telephone or cell phone company. While I am doing something entirely different - casting a free wi-fi cloud over an area in which I also run a hard headed business where my wireless customers get what they pay for - reliable bandwidth, secure traffic, 24/7 support. For a monthly charge (currently $65 a month). While everyone else gets a connection, with no guarantees. Free.
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permalink #139 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Sat 7 Dec 02 08:18
permalink #139 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Sat 7 Dec 02 08:18
Qwest has no problem with you sharing bandwidth? Might they change their mind about that if too many people do it? Wireless communities are a great idea and I support it, but they remind me a bit of freenets, right before independent ISPs and AOL put them out of business. Will there be the motivation to create clouds if no hotspot is more than five minutes away?
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permalink #140 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sat 7 Dec 02 16:45
permalink #140 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sat 7 Dec 02 16:45
I'm not sure what you are referring to that I do that uses Qwest? If I leased at T-1 to DS3 from Qwest for any reason, I would ne paying for that bandwidth - use it as I see fit. But I don;t even do that. I *bypass* Qwest wirelesslyy between my premises and my upstream provider. I cut out the local Qwest loop. Now why will someone in Old Colorado City, eating at LaBaguette, the French bakery, or Meadow Muffins, or sitting in the park - when there is a 'free' 802.11b cloud to connect through, drive 5 minutes (it will be actually 10 - 3 city-steet miles - to go in and connect up for a fee? I'm missing something here. Unless you are assuming that with the free connectivity 'cloud' goes free email box and account and filespace. I won't provide that. You will already have your own home account somewhere - like the Well, with its mail, filespace. And the minute your mobile machine is connected, and assigned you via DHCP an IP number, DNS IP, and gateway (automatically) you can read your home email with Eudora, Outlook, or telnet in and use Pine. But if you go to the nearest hot spot, you will be paying for TWO accounts - the temporary hot spot link, and your home email. Are we still on the same page?
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permalink #141 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Sat 7 Dec 02 18:00
permalink #141 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Sat 7 Dec 02 18:00
As you know, some cable providers have threatened to prosecute people for theft of services in violation of their use agreements for connecting their cable modems to 802.11 base stations. The question then becomes whether other providers will react in a similar manner, or whether you believe there will always be upstream Internet connectivity providers who will lease bandwidth without restricting the right to resell it.
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permalink #142 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sat 7 Dec 02 20:52
permalink #142 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sat 7 Dec 02 20:52
OK, I know the DSL and Cable racket. But I think it equally possible, in many places, if not all, that communities THEMSELVES provide the long line links. Things are so bad in the fiber sales business now, if I were on the West Coast I could personally buy a 'strand' all the way to the east coast for under $2000 a month. Capable of gigabit traffic. Its also called 'asset based' telecom - where the network is *owned* locally, or by local government, not large telc-like companies. Already done in Quebec province, Grants county Washington, and Allegeny County Maryland. Transit has become so cheap, there almost isn't a business model for it. Wi-Fi just adds to it, being free from you to a point of presence. I am pleased as punch that Wales, following my 'community wireless' prescription, just was funded by the Welsh National Assembly so that over the next two years 181 'communities' will have an Internet pipe '8mbps up/down' satellite service, 100% paid for by the Welsh government, coming into the center (or high point) of each 'community' - and, via a community owned server, reach out wirelessly (802.11b) to homes and offices in the village. People will buy their radios (40 pounds, maybe) and pay maybe 19 pounds a month for complete Internet, email, local server, service. While floundering British Telecom is saying theu have to have 450-700 guaranteed commercial customers (ADSL) inside those same villages, paying 45 pounds a month, before they can even extend their serices there! They are going to die! And when World Comm declared bankruptcy, there was panic in the UK and Wales, because WC provided fat pipes for Education, especially Universities. I sent a study to the Minister of Economic Development, Andrew Davies (who is 100% behind Wi-Fi for all Wales) and told him to forget contracting for another telco-like service. To lay their own gigabit fiber all over Wales. Like roads. Owned by government! And let the villages be connected to that! Wirelessly. (possible in that small country - distances are so short) He was startled, but it shook him out of the 'we always have to buy network fat pipes from bit companies' mindset. He's looking. My point is, with free wi-fi (and follow on more powerful radios which FCC Commissioner Michael Powell is going to permit) 'open spectrum' solutions are going to thrive.
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permalink #143 of 280: Thomas Armagost (silly) Sun 8 Dec 02 04:45
permalink #143 of 280: Thomas Armagost (silly) Sun 8 Dec 02 04:45
<scribbled by silly Sat 7 Jul 12 17:57>
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permalink #144 of 280: man with no pseudonym (cchoffme) Sun 8 Dec 02 07:00
permalink #144 of 280: man with no pseudonym (cchoffme) Sun 8 Dec 02 07:00
I can see it now. You are attracted to the stranger sitting next to you on the subway, and your green blinker starts going off. Soon enough, you get slapped without saying a word....
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permalink #145 of 280: Infradibulated Gratility (ssol) Sun 8 Dec 02 08:18
permalink #145 of 280: Infradibulated Gratility (ssol) Sun 8 Dec 02 08:18
Then again, at a business function (a convention, seminar, etc) I can see tech for broadcasting interests, experience, and affinities related to work as saving me from a lot of wasted conversations with well intentioned folks networking like crazy.
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permalink #146 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Sun 8 Dec 02 08:27
permalink #146 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Sun 8 Dec 02 08:27
So a group of folks in San Francisco could buy a fiber strand at $2000/month and redistribute a gigabit via 802.ll? Now that would be interesting. Thanks for the tip, Dave. In regard to proximity and affinity, Rick Borovoy has been doing interesting stuff with that. And there's this: <http://www.smartmobs.com/archives/000412.html#000412> A quite lukewarm review of Smart Mobs in today's Chronicle: <http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/chronicle/archive/2002/12/08/RV28 7.DTL> A more positive mention in today's San Jose Mercury: <http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/4693890.htm>
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permalink #147 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sun 8 Dec 02 09:25
permalink #147 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sun 8 Dec 02 09:25
Oh I don't know that the Chronicle's review is lukewarm. Its neutral, *except* where Mary intrudes her own fears of government surveillance by cybercops.
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permalink #148 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Sun 8 Dec 02 10:31
permalink #148 of 280: Howard Rheingold (hlr) Sun 8 Dec 02 10:31
The book is not devoid of close examination of the surveillance capabilities of these technologies and the political implications. Nor does it lack for advocacy of explicit policies that citizens ought to support: oppose the Hollings bill and other legislative and regulatory attempts to turn active users into passive consumers; support open spectrum and other regulatory proposals that open more of the spectrum for use as a commons; oppose the use of copyright law to diminish the public domain; insist on privacy controls in the design of technologies that reveal private information.
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permalink #149 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sun 8 Dec 02 13:58
permalink #149 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sun 8 Dec 02 13:58
One of the greater threats, than cybersurveillance, is the already afoot movements to try and basterdize unlicensed wireless. Trying to cram it back into the 'property model. Or pretend they can coexist. http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document= 6513282647 I don't trust Dave Farber. Never did.
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permalink #150 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sun 8 Dec 02 13:59
permalink #150 of 280: Dave Hughes (dave) Sun 8 Dec 02 13:59
As for 'supporting open spectrum' movements, be sure you FILE when the FCC comes out with their new NOI on Wednesday.
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