inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #126 of 177: Cliff Dweller (robinsline) Wed 25 Jan 17 11:30
    
There is a plaque, and a sign inside. Nothing really to see though.
They don't make anything of it and the place is full of laundry
machines (many out of order). 
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #127 of 177: Ed Ward (captward) Wed 25 Jan 17 12:18
    
Okay, that's incredible. Almost as incredible as the fact that for
years and years and years -- until the mid-'60s, when Marshall
Seahorn and Allen Toussaint opened Seasaint, in fact -- it was the
only studio in town. 

Studios can be magical places. I was once in United Sound in Detroit
with some friends and George Clinton and Bootsy Collins, waiting for
George to finish doing a drum track with Bootsy, and while they were
conferring in the booth, I saw a vibraphone standing in the studio,
so, never having really looked at one, I walked over and picked up
the two mallets. I hit two notes, then two more, and almost peed my
pants: I had just played the opening of "Baby Love," in the studio
where it had been recorded, possibly on the instrument it had been
played on. 

I put down the mallets and went back to waiting for George. 
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #128 of 177: Ed Ward (captward) Wed 25 Jan 17 12:25
    
<mcdee>, who was Marvin Gaye Gordy, ie, how did he fit in to the
story? Berry's son?

And <tcn>, I'm not sure what you're getting at in your first
paragraph at all, but as for cannabis, it goes back at least to
Louis Armstrong, a very vocal supporter, and was in widespread use
throughout the era I cover in this volume. Musicians loved it: they
knew the damage, not only physical and psychological, that alcohol
could do to a musician's ability to play, and it was a nice
alternative. The oldest person I ever smoked pot with was Cotton
Seed Collins, a Western Swing fiddler who was on the Willie Nelson
Shotgun Willie sessions, which I attended. "Doc looked at me one
day, he says 'Cotton, you don't stop drinkin', you'll be dead before
you're 40. Maybe younger than that.' I said Doc, what am I supposed
to do, and he said 'Well, I don't advise this, but if you go talk to
some Mexican fellas about this stuff called grifa...' and I did and
I been usin' it ever since!" This would have been the early '30s,
judging from the records of his I have. 
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #129 of 177: Mark McDonough (mcdee) Wed 25 Jan 17 12:39
    
I don't even come close to knowing the Gordy family tree, which has
many branches, but as near as I can figure out, he is the son of
Marvin Gaye and Denise Gordy, who was Barry Gordy's niece.  He was
later adopted by Anna Gordy, her aunt (and Barry Gordy's sister).

Cue "I'm My Own Grandpa."
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #130 of 177: Ozro W. Childs (oz) Wed 25 Jan 17 14:16
    
I first heard rock 'n roll in about 1955 when I was 10. My initial source
was the Lucky Lager hit parade -- some beer company anyhow. Then in 1957 I
went to junior high and there was this amazing daytime station out of Santa
Monica, KDAY. Absolutely everyone in my school listened to it every
afternoon and twice on weekends.

I think among my peers, the first rock record was Earth Angel. Even though
it was a slow song, if you went to the hop, it was played for the slow
dances. But the truly magnetic performer was Little Richard. Elvis was
Elvis, and did do "Jailhouse Rock" but he wasn't really a rock 'n roll
performer. Nor was Chuck Berry, not in the way Little Richard was. Now as an
oldie we of course heard Bill Haley and his comets. He was allegedly the
first rock star. But again, it was Little Richard who got people up and
dancing.

We did live in a time when many different genres were to be heard on the
same radio station. And also, a great many R&B records that we white kids
never heard when we were small are revived and replayed after 1955, It was
easy to see the connection between R&B and rock.

What was really sad was that old-fashioned rock pretty much died out in the
years between, say, 1959 or 1960 and the revival that started with the
Beatles.
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #131 of 177: Ed Ward (captward) Wed 25 Jan 17 14:20
    
And Anna was in the record business before Berry (not Barry),
because she owned the Chess-distributed Anna label where Berry had
to park "Money" by Barrett Strong because after recording and
mastering it he didn't have enough money to press and distribute it
himself. 

A large, but complicated, family, indeed, but their incredible
ability to organize and pool resources helped Berry set up his
record store and, after that failed, raise the money for what
eventually became Motown. 

Slip from <oz>, which I'll deal with next. 
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #132 of 177: Ed Ward (captward) Wed 25 Jan 17 14:23
    
<oz>, I gather you haven't read the book. To say "Elvis was
Elvis, and did do "Jailhouse Rock" but he wasn't really a rock 'n
roll
performer. Nor was Chuck Berry, not in the way Little Richard was."
is patently ridiculous. Elvis liked to rock, but after he got out of
the Army he got less and less chance to do it until the famous '68
comeback special. Chuck Berry may have had different roots than
Richard, but I can't see how you can claim that the guy who wrote
and had hits with songs like "School Day," "Rock and Roll Music,"
"Johnny B. Goode" and "Sweet Little Rock and Roller" wasn't a rock
and roll performer. 
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #133 of 177: David Wilson (dlwilson) Wed 25 Jan 17 14:38
    
<129>  Marvin Gay's wife in 1977 to 81 was Jan, the daughter of Slim
Gaillard.
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #134 of 177: those Andropovian bongs (rik) Wed 25 Jan 17 14:49
    
#127  So sweet.

"Baby Love" and "Where Did Our Love Go" were the first rock tunes that 
made me pay attention to the rhythm section..  It was different from what 
I'd been hearing and got my attention.  Everything fell squarely, with 
each quarter note getting equal emphasis.  The kick and the snare were of 
equal volume, and everything else in the track seemed to come down four on 
the floor.  

It was different than the Beatles and Stones, and that's what 
got my attention with Motown   On the Beatles' "Twist and Shout", the 
rhythm section is almost buried.   It's all guitars and vocals.  Get up 
to "I Want To Hold Your Hand", and the kick is out there, but the snare 
is buried.  Motown had the difference that made a difference..
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #135 of 177: Ed Ward (captward) Wed 25 Jan 17 15:01
    
Well, Berry always said that "The Sound Of Young America" meant that
the tambourine was there so even white folks could dance to it. (Of
course, he never said that in public). 

I met Jan Gaye on the frenetic, cocaine-paranoia few days I chased
Marvin around LA for a CREEM article that never happened because I
never was able to talk to him and my photographer couldn't get him
to sit still long enough to take pictures. This was just before the
Here, My Dear album. Very weird times. But I had no idea she was
Slim Gaillard's daughter!
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #136 of 177: Mark McDonough (mcdee) Wed 25 Jan 17 17:17
    
The movie "Standing in the Shadows of Motown" gave me an entirely
new perspective.  

I realized instantly (once the move helpfully pointed it out) that a
big part of what's kept me coming back to those songs is the superb
musicianship - not least those rhythm sections.  

If I'd asked any of my buddies at the time what they thought of the
great musicians who were always on those Motown hits, I'm pretty
sure the response would have been "huh?" 

I guess growing up in the shadows of Jimi Hendrix, as it were, made
us all blind to any playing that didn't call attention to itself.

Great playing was part of the Motown formula, but not part of the
image.
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #137 of 177: Ed Ward (captward) Wed 25 Jan 17 17:47
    
See, this concentration on individuals is so recent, but the great
players have been there all along. Who knew the names of the
sidemen? Who cared? Back in this era, pop music was supposed to be
disposable enjoyment: chew it until it loses its flavor, then stick
it on the underside of the desk!
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #138 of 177: Mark McDonough (mcdee) Wed 25 Jan 17 19:07
    
Right. But the great sidemen (and a few women) were part of the
appeal all along and it's kind of fun to realize that. At least it's
fun for me. I can see how it could take you in an over-analytical
direction and spoil the experience, but I don't seem to wired that
way.

You tell me that the key ingredient in my favorite dish is fenugreek
and I'll take a bite, say "Wow, you're right!" ...and then I'll go
right back to enjoying it.
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #139 of 177: (fom) Wed 25 Jan 17 20:39
    
   >If I'd been hanging with Mike Bloomfield in Chicago in 1961

   >The twist was a very important moment. It started as a midwestern
   teenage black thing

I first met Mike around '62 (His wife was besties with my friend Benita) 
and he was presenting traditional Southern Black musicians at the... 
Purple Onion? Fickle Pickle? Some name like that. I remember one of the 
musicians was Little Brother Montgomery.

Then, at my college, we had the Wednesday night Twist Parties and they 
were major. Butterfield, Bloomfield, Mark Naftalin, Elvin Bishop, and 
several South Side musicians whose names I should know but don't. Well, 
Sam Lay for sure.

My friends and I would go to the South Side clubs occasionally and I'll 
try to remember the names of the bands. 
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #140 of 177: Darrell Jonsson (jonsson) Thu 26 Jan 17 11:44
    

I heard someone say once on TV or the radio that the twist was a
revolution, not just the music but the body language, the
independent role of the dancers. Can't remember the source.
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #141 of 177: David Gans (tnf) Thu 26 Jan 17 12:22
    

My parents bought that Chubby Checker record and then invited a neighborhood
teenager to teach them The Twist. This would have been in 1961 I guess.
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #142 of 177: those Andropovian bongs (rik) Thu 26 Jan 17 12:23
    
The Twist really was so easy that anyone could do it.   Even me. 
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #143 of 177: Mark McDonough (mcdee) Thu 26 Jan 17 15:46
    
I know I'm going to make some of you feel old, but my kindergarten
teacher taught us how to do it!
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #144 of 177: those Andropovian bongs (rik) Thu 26 Jan 17 15:53
    
I just realized something about the Twist.   Chubby Checker gave me, and 
god knows how many others, permission to dance.  Much like the way Dylan 
gave us all permission to sing.
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #145 of 177: Scott Underwood (esau) Thu 26 Jan 17 15:57
    
Do I remember right that the Twist is mostly upper body? No sexy hip
action?
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #146 of 177: Mark McDonough (mcdee) Thu 26 Jan 17 16:00
    
Not the way my kindergarten teacher taught it!
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #147 of 177: those Andropovian bongs (rik) Thu 26 Jan 17 16:39
    
Only when the Irish do it, Scott.  For the rest of us the whole torso was 
involved.  We even devloped a variant called the Spider, which was the 
Twist with more arm and leg stuff going on.   
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #148 of 177: Scott Underwood (esau) Thu 26 Jan 17 18:57
    
All right. I wondered if perhaps that's what made it more acceptable.

On the other hand, I'm thinking of it as yet another in a long series of
dance crazes, mostly Latin, to sweep the US, like the tango, samba,
mambo, and even up to the Macarena. 
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #149 of 177: David Wilson (dlwilson) Thu 26 Jan 17 19:47
    <scribbled by dlwilson Thu 26 Jan 17 19:52>
  
inkwell.vue.496 : History of Rock and Roll - Volume 1
permalink #150 of 177: David Wilson (dlwilson) Thu 26 Jan 17 19:59
    
The latin dance crazes were for adults done in another era or in an
another market.  The dance crazes of the 60's --the twist, the slop,
the mash potato, fly, hitchhike, shing-a-ling, popeye etc were
generated by the labels and marketed to teenagers.  American Bandst
was instrumental in promoting them.  I remember listening to the
radio and watching bandstand and then going to teen dances and sure
enough, the newest dance was sure to show up after the accumulated
previous "it" dances.  The twist was much bigger than any of those
others though. 
  

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