Inkwell: Authors and Artists

    
Ben, you mention having done a radio series that included two documentarists
whom you admire: Julia Reichert and Les Blank, both sadly departed. I really
liked Reichert's UNTITLED DAVE CHAPPELLE DOCUMENTARY, and I was newly
enthralled by a recently restored version of Blank's J'AI ETE AU BAL (about
Cajun/Zydeco musicians). Which films of theirs do you especially admire?
What do you like about them?
  

    
Les Blank has been an idol/marvel going back to, well, obviously to
my mid-20s when I did that radio series. "Chulas Fronteras", "Always
for Pleasure" are standouts for me. "Burden of Dreams" is great (I
first interviewed him for KZSC when that came out). His films are
just marvels, such a distinct feel, casual yet so well shot and put
together--what a great cameraman--and he was truly independent both
in how he made his career and how he approached filmmaking. I think
too that his work will only grow in value over time, as documents of
music and food of course but also whole communities.

Julie Reichert was already, forty years ago (!) something of an icon
for those admiring or seeking to make documentaries about social
issue topics, yet in a deeply personal and up-close style that she
continued throughout her career. "Seeing Red" is not as shown today,
but struck me then for its portrayal of a few folks of the old-left.
I still often recall one of the final lines from one of her subjects
(paraphrasing): "Life is just a fast drop from the womb to the
tomb...shouldn't we have a say in what happens in that fall?"

When I did the radio project I visited Les and Julia Reichert, hung
out with each for a couple/few days--which I look back on as a life
highlight for sure, and think back on often.

The other filmmaker I profiled for that radio series was Wayne Wang,
that was more of a straight interview situation. I was and remain a
big admirer of "Chan is Missing". Love that film.
  

    
There's a lot of documentary in CHAN IS MISSING.
  

    
After Les Blank released Garlic Is As Good As Ten Mothers my friend
Maria Makela brought Les to a nearby church to show it. I helped
peel several pounds of garlic for the huge pot of beans Les made to
perfume the hall and the audience.
  

    
Yes, Chan is Missing is what we now might call a hybrid film,
something that’s become much more common since. The fact that that
film is such a product of, and emerged from that community and
experience at that time makes it so powerful. 
  

    
I have two unrelated questions:

1. Max Roach is a big deal to me and my world.  But he is not well known
among people who aren't fans of jazz. He's not  one those figures that
people who don't listen to jazz know about--Louis Armstrong, Duke
Ellington, Charlie Parker, Dizzy Gillspie, Miles Davis, John Coltrane, etc.
Did y'all ever have to pitch the movie to people who were totally unfamiliar
with Roach? If so, how did you do that?  What sorts of hoops did you have to
jump through?

2. What was involved in getting the cooperation of Roach's children?  Did
you or Pollard have a relationship with them prior or unrelated to the
movie?  What kind of negotiation is involved in getting the participation of
family members in such a doc?
  

    
Good questions both.

1. You are absolutely right--Max isn't a public "name" in the way
those others are--and we pose the question at the beginning of the
film as to why that is (to Max's daughter Maxine). With this the
case, the pitch becomes more of "There was this man Max Roach, and
he had this extraordinary life..." as opposed to "We want to make a
film about [celebrity X] from this unique and compelling
perspective/approach". It worked out of course, but I wouldn't say
it was overall an easy film to fundraise around, and especially
nowadays when things are so celebrity-focused. We pitched the film
to many--steaming services, foreign broadcasters, others--over a
period of maybe 7-8 years. And wrote grants. And treatments. Our
initial fundraising success was from a foundation where top level
folks already knew about Max Roach, and also funded specifically
jazz related events/films etc. In early stages we kept costs very
low, and were able to get the interviews done and a cut of the film
to show funders and broadcasters--that of course is the best pitch
of all, if the material is strong. With that, we rounded up the
funding we needed to finish.

2. Sam had spent a good deal of time with Max when he was filming
him in the late 80s-90s, and  the kids knew about that, remembered
Sam from then. Dealing with the family was, in this case Max's
children, multi-faceted in the sense that we wanted to: interview
each of them, have access and use of the Max Roach archives, use his
compositions, and so on. The Roach family has always been supportive
of this film, which is not always the case. Once we discussed the
basic terms of an agreement, we got a draft from their lawyer, and
there was that usual back and forth process of reviewing and
requesting changes, our lawyer to their lawyer. 

Basically with documentaries, its about building a trail of
agreements for every single thing you use in the film that is
owned/controlled by someone else.
  

    
(bshapiro), thanks for your thoughtful responses and taking the time to
respond to all the questions.
  

    
Today is the last day of the two weeks set for this conversation. We
want to thank Ben Shapiro for joining us, and Gary Lambert for
leading the discussion. While this is the formally designated end
after two weeks, this topic will remain open after today and it's
fine to continue posting. 

Reminder that you can view "The Drum Also Waltzes" on PBS:
<https://www.pbs.org/wnet/americanmasters/max-roach-the-drum-also-waltzes-film/
26469/>

I also happened up a YouTube stream of the Max Roach album with the
same name: <https://youtu.be/_AS71j5nysw?si=-Iicgztv1zIvsTsQ>

Ben's website is <https://www.benshapiro.net/>. 

Feel free to share this conversation with this URL:
<https://tinyurl.com/drum-waltz>
  

    
Thanks, I enjoyed it. And just to add, the film is now and ongoing
available (after the free PBS streaming ends this weekend) on Amazon
Prime video:

https://www.primevideo.com/detail/Max-Roach-The-Drum-Also-Waltzes/0KZHCGBOO1J2
5GXTGBXVPQSHN0
  

    
Ben, one last question from me. Do you have any upcoming projects you'd like
to tell us about?
  

    
Mainly now I'm working on stuff related to this movie--festivals,
Q&A's and promotion, distribution and still some biz details. 

The thing immediately on my plate is the Radio Diaries series of
short pieces about people buried on Hart Island (NYC's potters
field). We're finishing them up week by week as they air on All
Things Considered.

Oh and Sam and I are developing another project about a music who
started a record label, but that's far in future.

There's always this thing they say that when you finish a film you
should have your next project in pocket set to start. Soon...
  

    
Thanks, Ben! 

I just want to say - having watched and rewatched "The Drum Also
Waltzes" - it's an excellent documentary, and it's great to see Max
Roach getting the attention.
  

    
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it.
  

    
> The thing immediately on my plate is the Radio Diaries series of
 short pieces about people buried on Hart Island (NYC's potters
 field). We're finishing them up week by week as they air on All
 Things Considered.

I'm just learning about "The Unmarked Graveyard." It's amazing to learn that
a million people are buried there on Hart Island!

Thanks, Ben, for your answers. I hope we'll be able to interview you about
another project soon!
  

    
Here's the link to hear the Unmarked Graveyard pieces:

https://www.npr.org/series/1204141877/the-unmarked-graveyard

Thanks Frako.