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permalink #201 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 14:35
permalink #201 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 14:35
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permalink #202 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 14:50
permalink #202 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 14:50
Hi Gail. Thanks for those links. Castaneda was quite the Trickster. I'm thinking of Bumbaugh's and my exchange about the role of the surreal and hallucinations in the literature of this time period. While my approach is to analyze these texts in terms of how much they adhere or deviate from the traditional narrative structural formwithin which surreal depictions and metaphors play a stylistic roleI think it would also be fascinating to focus just on the mechanisms with which surreal and hallucinated prose have been used in literature. This might starting with Alice in Wonderland and proceed through European and Beat surrealism and on to these works I've looked at. In such a study, Castaneda's work would most certainly warrant inclusion, whether it is non-fictional fraud, or metaphorically enlightening fiction that was mispackaged. There is no question his works had a significant impact in the '70s especially. This said, I still have a problem with bullshitters. And Carlos was a master fraud.
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permalink #203 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 14:52
permalink #203 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 14:52
Thanks, Mario, the Earl Campbell fan. I think you've outlined very astutely the history of the evolving drug scene. I also think it came down much as you suggest. (Acid Dreams offers another straight-up look at Psychedelia). Long ago I came to see that those of us in America (and Canada and Western Europe) live in a proverbial drug store of legal and illegal drugs. When it comes right down to it, the individual must come to terms with how he or she chooses to self-medicate.
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Scott MacFarlane, "The Hippie Narrative"
permalink #204 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 15:15
permalink #204 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 15:15
And Gail...Andrew Leonard's little piece on playing chess with Vonnegut is wonderful. Thx.
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permalink #205 of 349: Cynthia Dyer-Bennet (cdb) Thu 12 Apr 07 18:48
permalink #205 of 349: Cynthia Dyer-Bennet (cdb) Thu 12 Apr 07 18:48
> Martin Torgoff's excellent book, _Can't Find My Way Home_ We talked with Martin Torgoff here, see <inkwell.vue.214> NOTE: Offsite readers with comments of questions can send them to <inkwell@well.com> to have them added to the conversation. ****************** Back on track, it's interesting to me that when people point to The Drug that ended the peace/love movement, heroin and speed always get mention, but cocaine is rarely brought up. In my experience, coke had a much broader, deleterious effect. It saw it as a drug that inspired greed and alienation.
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permalink #206 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 20:12
permalink #206 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 12 Apr 07 20:12
>>> from Cynthia: Back on track, it's interesting to me that when people point to The Drug that ended the peace/love movement, heroin and speed always get mention, but cocaine is rarely brought up. >>> In my experience, coke had a much broader, deleterious effect. It saw it as a drug that inspired greed and alienation. I'm not sure you're any more on track with this than the Oilers Fan, but, hey, I agree with your observations, too. ;=) Snorters were far, far more prevalent than hopheads. As for speed, it has grown over the years into a scourge, especially in the rural areas. In The Hippie Narrative, I tried my best to be dispassionate about my examination of the era's drugs, and, in order to keep on track while writing this book, I looked at various drugs in the context of the text being studied. The Chief Broom character in Cuckoo's Nest was peyote inspired; Siddhartha was on a natural high, but the work exhibited a very hallucinated tone near the end; LSD, shockingly, was the focal point of The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test and Divine Right's Trip; HST in Fear & Loathing is mostly crazed from a cocktail of Acid and Speed, it seems; The Fan Man is pothead through and through; Tom Robbins' characters vascillates through an array of psychedelic influences; Denis Johnson in "The Hippies" is the recovered junkie on mushrooms. Marcus Boon's book, "The Road of Excess: A History of Writers on Drugs" helped me make a link between the writer's depicted drug of choice and how that substance influenced the prose of these books. I don't think anyone can make an honest exploration of the counterculture without examining the drugs, but the easy dismissal of the era's profound array of societal impacts because of drugs is irresponsible scholarship. Anyone trying to understand the era, must look beyond the drugs, too.
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permalink #207 of 349: "The Best for Your Health!" (rik) Fri 13 Apr 07 06:48
permalink #207 of 349: "The Best for Your Health!" (rik) Fri 13 Apr 07 06:48
It was quite clear to anyone in town that the decline of Haight-Ashbury, in the late 60s coincided with a steep rise in the use of injected drugs like heroin and speed. This also coincided with an influx of predators who saw the peace and love people as easy marks. I'm speaking both as an observer and as a data point who was mugged just off Haight St by a couple of junkies, in 68. They came right out and said that they had habits to support.
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permalink #208 of 349: Michael Zentner (mz) Fri 13 Apr 07 08:24
permalink #208 of 349: Michael Zentner (mz) Fri 13 Apr 07 08:24
Coke didn't really come on the scene until around 1970.
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permalink #209 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 08:47
permalink #209 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 08:47
>> It was quite clear to anyone in town that the decline of Haight-Ashbury, in the late 60s coincided with a steep rise in the use of injected drugs like heroin and speed. And, from everything I've read from people who were living in The Haight from '65-'70, (Emmett Grogan, Keith Abbott, Peter Coyote, HST) there was the pre-Media invasion where the neighborhood was a mostly peaceful bohemian enclave; then came invasion of '67-'68 where the Haight was flooded with streetkids, white drugs to inject and snort, and a strange media hype that both romanticized and ostracized those in the neighborhood; and, as you and many others point out, the scene got strangely ugly. Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test is useful for describing the social dynamic that led to this Psychedelia that erupted nowhere more noticably than in Haight/Ashbury. The flowerchild/flowerpower hyperbole, of course, was a media creation, although the collectivist attempts to create community in this chaotic social vacuum were not, and there was a hippie altuism and hopefulness that went beyond the drugs. The shift to hard drugs was very real, as you point out. The cops, who had largely ignored the Haight prior to '67 were under a lot of political pressure to crack down on the drug scene, which they did. Again, The Haight got very bleak. So, to use this neighborhood as indicative of the hippie phenomenon as a whole, makes sense up to the beginning of 1967, but during and after '67 The Haight became a distorted microcosm. The hippie phenomenon, as soon as the hard core ugliness began, was already diffusing, was already in many different places and beginning to manifest itself in a number of different ways. I think the huge popularity of cocaine came later in the '70s and was affordable, mostly, by more affluent people. I think Cynthia is speaking of a wider cultural phenomenon in the '70s. I don't know if accurate data is available, but it would be interesting to compare the numbers of young people on a yearly basis from 1965 to 1980 who actually used marijuana, LSD and other strong hallucinogens, speed, heroine and cocaine to look for trends. But, again, my focus in The Hippie Narrative, is not to ignore the drugs, but to allow the key works of literature to depict the era, which often included its drugs. LSD was a primary factor that differentiated the Beats from the hippies, and LSD was the catalyst for this Psyhedelia which is integrally linked to the hippies. This broader array of drugs impacted far more than the hippies. I would not describe today's drug culture as "hippie" though the counterculture did much to create the drug culture, and a hippie influence is still there.
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permalink #210 of 349: "The Best for Your Health!" (rik) Fri 13 Apr 07 08:54
permalink #210 of 349: "The Best for Your Health!" (rik) Fri 13 Apr 07 08:54
By the early 70s, a lot of hippies were dropping back in. They had jobs and the wherewithall to afford cocaine. Coke was the antithesis drug, and was an antidote to hippiedom. As cdb said, it's about greed and alienation. It certainly brought out the worst in me.
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permalink #211 of 349: Michael Zentner (mz) Fri 13 Apr 07 09:00
permalink #211 of 349: Michael Zentner (mz) Fri 13 Apr 07 09:00
My dad lived in the Haight during the late 40's because it was the cheapest neighborhood he could find. He was going to UC Berkeley on the GI bill.
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permalink #212 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 09:11
permalink #212 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 09:11
>> By the early 70s, a lot of hippies were dropping back in. They had jobs and the wherewithall to afford cocaine. Coke was the antithesis drug, and was an antidote to hippiedom. As cdb said, it's about greed and alienation. It certainly brought out the worst in me. There's an autobiography here.
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permalink #213 of 349: Cynthia D-B (peoples) Fri 13 Apr 07 09:27
permalink #213 of 349: Cynthia D-B (peoples) Fri 13 Apr 07 09:27
And I hope rik writes it. It'd be a fascinating read! But back to your book, Scott. In the heart of our discussions this week, you mentioned Slaughterhouse-Five as one of your all time favorite books. Then, of course, Wednesday we learn the sad news of his passing. At one point you used the term "Geodesic Vonnegut." Can you explain a bit more what you mean by this?
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permalink #214 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 11:41
permalink #214 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 11:41
Some of the books I examined have virtually no literary criticism written about them, such as Divine Right's Trip and The Fan Man, while others such as Cuckoo's Nest, The Crying of Lot 49 and Slaughterhouse-Five have been thoroughly examined by literary scholars from all sorts of angles. When I closely examined S-5 I was looking for a way to describe its unusual "unstuck in time" literary structure. Such descriptions are inherently "metaphorical," but I really liked the term geodesic which came from a John L. Somer article called "Geodesic Vonnegut; or If Buckminster Fuller Wrote Novels." Fuller, of course, was the eccentric scientist who "invented" the geodesic dome which used the least amount of materials to construct a very strong dwelling with the most amount of space. Also, it's the only man-made structure that gets proportionally stronger as it increases in size. I thought that this was a great way to describe S-5, not only because the G-Dome had its run as chic alternative housing in the '70s, but because, with S-5, Vonnegut's story is much stronger in its totality than when viewing its independent scenes. There are three plot lines in S-5 that are broken apart, revisited seemingly at whim, yet which come togetherlike triangular components of a G-Dometo create a schizophrenic whole which not only portrays Billy Pilgrim's fractured psychological state, but more profoundly, the fractured state of modern man. Even though the novel proceeds as though it is unstuck in time, Vonnegut's sparse prose revisits three threads of plot again and again. There is Billy Pilgrim in 1968 as a detached Optometrist living a sedate, though alienated, upper-middle class life in Ohio; there is Billy Pilgrim the 21-year-old assistant chaplain in the US Army at the end of WWII, and; there is Billy Pilgrim who time travels to the planet Tralfamadore where he is placed in a cage with a voluptuous earthling with whom he is supposed to mate. It is the juxtaposing of bits and pieces of these three plotlines that give the novel its fractured tone. Also, using bits of metafiction where Vonnegut plays himself as a young soldier draws attention to the narrative structure. The author also gives away the ending; he routinely breaks the traditional mold of a continuous fictional dream. This causes the reader to experience, to a certain extent, the schizophrenic mental state of the protagonist. Yet, even though we are told early in the novel that Billy Pilgrim will survive the massive firebombing of Dresden, Germany, when this takes place at the end of the novel, it is still climactic. The geodesic structure of this narrative is completed with this scene, so to speak, and the author has found a most innovative way to convey, viscerally, the complete fragmented essence of the protagonist. Sound travels too well through a G-Dome, and there is something about Billy Pilgrim that echoes through all of us.
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permalink #215 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 12:17
permalink #215 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 12:17
(NOTE: Off-site readers with comments or questions may send them to <inkwell@well.com> to them added to this conversation)
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permalink #216 of 349: Cynthia Dyer-Bennet (cdb) Fri 13 Apr 07 12:47
permalink #216 of 349: Cynthia Dyer-Bennet (cdb) Fri 13 Apr 07 12:47
With Vonnegut's recent death and your fascinating exploration into one of his most compelling novels, I'm getting an itch to read S5 again. I've read it perhaps half a dozen times since I first discovered it in the '60s, but it's been at least a decade since my last reading. What a writer he was, and thanks for digging into this so thoroughly, Scott. You've called Slaughterhouse-Five an experimental form of narrative. You've also said this about the structure of Trout Fishing in America. How are these two novels similar and different in this regard?
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permalink #217 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 13:39
permalink #217 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 13:39
Thanks, Cynthia. In The Hippie Narrative I talk about John Gardner's book The Art of Fiction quite a bit. Gardner describes three types of novels: lyrical (such as Proust's Swan's Way), juxtapositional (such as Donald Barthelme's Snow White), or energeic (which includes most traditionally rendered narratives where the potential of the character is actualized through situational conflict). Gardner also describes the continuous fictional dream as a trait of the traditional novel. Metafiction, where the author draws attention to the design of his or her narrative, was used by authors such as Vonnegut and Tom Robbins to either frame the story, or to exact some comedic or didactic effect. In addition to using metafiction, Vonnegut breaks S-5 into numerous "unstuck in time" segments, which I just described. It should also be noted here that Vonnegut makes this seem effortless with his unassuming style and careful segues between sections. He knows how to transition without losing the reader. Beneath this seemingly simple prose, the structure is rather complex and we must remember that it took Vonnegut 23 years to figure out a narrative strategy through which to tell this amazing personal story. Richard Brautigan has only short vignettes in Trout Fishing in America and, hence, no sustained continuous dream to interrupt. So to call this metafiction would not be accurate. Actually, it is often difficult to tell who or what the narrator is in Trout Fishing. S-5 and Trout Fishing are similar in their juxtapositional structures that, with geodesic fashioning, come to create a narrative whole. Trout Fishing deviates more than S-5 from the conventional narrative, because S-5 brings the three linear threads together with a crescendo. The climax, again, is in the scene where the fire bombing takes place. By comparison, Trout Fishing is a series of vignettes that circle the same thematic motiftrout fishing in America. At the end of the short novel, the reader has a multifaceted impression of Brauigan's pastorally-challenged imagining of all that this motif might and may no longer be in America. In its juxtapostional irony and full departure from the traditional narrative form, Trout Fishing is even more important than S-5 as a seminal work of postmodern literature.
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permalink #218 of 349: Cogito, Ergo Dubito (robertflink) Fri 13 Apr 07 19:42
permalink #218 of 349: Cogito, Ergo Dubito (robertflink) Fri 13 Apr 07 19:42
Scott, I just occurred to me that Eric Hoffer would have been working and writing in San Francisco during hippie times. He must have included hippies among his many observations of life there. Are you aware of any?
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permalink #219 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 20:36
permalink #219 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Fri 13 Apr 07 20:36
From what little I know of Hoffer, he was big on the concept of individual self-esteem. Lack of this gave rise to a sort of externalization that gave rise to such phenomenon as Nazism. I do know that late in his life, he was critical of the New Left and blamed this on modern affluence which delayed the rite of passage into adulthood. I suspect he would view the hippies as similarly stuck in a prolonged state of adolescence. To some extent he's correct, but the sort of adulthood that was sponsoring the protracted war in Vietnam and unfettered industrial excesses of the '60s, and which touted the consumer fruits of affluence as sufficient to the human condition, also bears a measure of responsibility for the youthful reaction against such a 'system.'
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permalink #220 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Sat 14 Apr 07 08:35
permalink #220 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Sat 14 Apr 07 08:35
One of the sublime joys of writing is not necessarily in finding answers, but sometimes in feeling like you've stumbled upon the right questions: [Marcus] Boon [in The Road of Excess: A History of Writers on Drugs] goes on to point out how the manner in which [Hunter S.] Thompson describes his hallucinated states is related to the authors orientation toward the sacred context, which is to say that it is not sacred at all, but profane: Psychedelics amplified the crisis that modernism found itself in with regard to the question of literary form. So long as psychedelics were experienced within an atheistic worldview, they produced convoluted, fragmentary, chaotic snakes of text. When Huxley [in Doors of Perception] took mescaline in a sacred context, this apparent disorder subsided into a kind of lucid clarity [ ] But later nontheistic explorations of the psychedelic realms, such as Burroughs and Hunter Thompsons, returned to textual turbulence, suggesting that it too cannot be wished away so easily. (274) Thompsons text is certainly turbulent and his philosophy nontheistic. Intriguingly, this causal connection by Boon presupposes a larger observation with regard to those in the counterculture. Those inclined toward the spiritual with its sacred contextif Boons premise holdswould be more likely to find, while high on hallucinogens, a lucid clarity in their belief in a higher force. Thompson, by comparison, uses textual turbulence as a literary device to help him depict the fractured nature of the drugged state in a way that emulates the chaos and destructiveness of the modern American State. He is not seeking spiritual enlightenment or lucidity, and doesnt find it. His textual turbulence, while rendered in the context of a traditional narrative structure, is also fractured in a postmodernist sense. (185-186)
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permalink #221 of 349: Cynthia D-B (peoples) Sat 14 Apr 07 09:05
permalink #221 of 349: Cynthia D-B (peoples) Sat 14 Apr 07 09:05
> Those inclined toward the spiritual with its sacred context -- if Boon's > premise holds -- would be more likely to find, while high on > hallucinogens, a lucid clarity in their belief in a higher force I'm not eager to get into a discussion of religion, but this rankles a bit. The adjectives I see in reference to use of psychedelics by a non-religious, non-seeker seem to lean toward a negative spin of the user. "fractured," "chaotic" and so forth. I'd argue that one doesn't need to be a seeker to find clarity and calm in a psychedelic excursion. Do you think of yourself as a seeker, Scott?
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permalink #222 of 349: Infradibulated Gratility (ssol) Sat 14 Apr 07 13:31
permalink #222 of 349: Infradibulated Gratility (ssol) Sat 14 Apr 07 13:31
!
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permalink #223 of 349: Cynthia D-B (peoples) Sat 14 Apr 07 17:49
permalink #223 of 349: Cynthia D-B (peoples) Sat 14 Apr 07 17:49
Perhaps that's not a fair question, and it's certainly not all that germane to your book's focus, Scott. I was just curious. Let me try another tack... There's a link on Salon.com to this conversation. It asks: "How did Kurt Vonnegut's "Slaughterhouse Five" influence a generation?" I know you didn't write this, but how would you answer the question?
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permalink #224 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Sat 14 Apr 07 18:56
permalink #224 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Sat 14 Apr 07 18:56
>> I'd argue that one doesn't need to be a seeker to find clarity and calm in a psychedelic excursion. In the '60s there was a great deal of talk about treating hallucinogens as a sacrament, centering oneself when taking them. A great many people have talked about psychedelics opening themselves to believing in a higher presence. In Fear & Loathing, on the other hand, HST does his best to debunk the idea of any higher light at the end of the tunnel. His hallucinated prose is jaded, often paranoid and, yes, frequently fractured and chaotic. Burroughs' prose also exhibits these qualities. I was intrigued by Boone's observations on different prose as a way to comment on the relationship between one's spiritual state and the experience one might have on powerful hallucinogens. Without suggesting that this proves or disproves any religious premise, the question of this correlation fascinates me. Not that I'm glad it rankled you, but I am pleased that you are willing to challenge this premise. Absolutes are always dangerous, but I would still enjoy delving into this possible connection more. >> Do you think of yourself as a seeker, Scott? Yes, but I think at this time I am more of an intellectual seeker than a spiritual one. I do believe in a higher power and its grand mystery, but I am also highly skeptical of organized religion or with those who profess to have the truth. I hope to be grateful for my life when I'm dead and welcoming to the truths of the other side when it's time. I think my fascination with the Sixties has to do in a large part with an interest in separating its sheer escapism from those earnest attempts at human transcendence, especially through the ethereal power of collectivist synergy.
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permalink #225 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Sat 14 Apr 07 19:32
permalink #225 of 349: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Sat 14 Apr 07 19:32
"How did Kurt Vonnegut's "Slaughterhouse Five" influence a generation?" I know you didn't write this, but how would you answer the question? Vonnegut managed to find an accessible, yet profoundly imploring way through a bit of Sci-Fi, a bit of mad irony, and a bit of sensory wisdom to cut through the war-is-our-duty-as-God-fearing-anticommunist-Americans mindset of 1960s. In part because of his innovative, "unstuck in time" narrative structure that emulated a schizophrenic mindset, Vonnegut's work was not just pacifist, but a clarion cry for human reason and responsibility. The book's publication in 1969 had particular appeal to a generation harboring legitimate questions about the Vietnam War. More than this, S-5 offered a more mainstream voice as well in raising US involvement in Vietnam to a level of wider condemnation. Though S-5 concerned WWII, it undermined the popularity of America's involvement in that war by highlighting, what was then, a little known fact about the fire bombing of a city that, at this late stage of the WWII, had no strategic military justification. For all these reasons, S-5 became a favorite of the counterculture (and the liberal mainstream, too).
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