We are very fortunate to have Derek Woodgate and Patrick Lichty to discuss where we are presently, and what's coming in regards to Virtual Reality, Mediated Reality and Augmented Reality. Derek Woodgate (http://futures-lab.com/home) is a consulting futurist, author, university lecturer and curator. He has been President of The Futures Lab, Inc. for 21 years. Within the futures field he is known as both the tech futurist and the creative futurist. Derek's principal expertise is in the corporate and institutional futures. His past roles on the board of two major corporations and 17 years SVP level strategic experience provided the corporate background. Prior to that he was a diplomat with the British FCO. Patrick Lichty (voyd.com) is a media reality artist, curator, and theorist of over two decades who explores how media and mediation affect our perception of reality. Ted Newcomb has been gadding about the WELL since 1995 and happily co-hosting Inkwell for several years. He is a happily retired grandfather and actively doing nothing.
Thank you both for sharing your time and expertise with us. You come from unique perspectives and active involvements in this Fourth Wave (stealing from both Alvin Toffler and Robert Scoble). I guess the basic questions floating around these days are: Can tech be trusted? Have we made a mistake committing to a digital future? How do we integrate all this into a happy, healthy life for ourselves, our families, communities, world? Does that life exclude privacy, security and freedom as we have known them? What's your takes on where we are and where we are going...the short run and the long run? Derek, what are the possible futures and practical presents? Patrick, if the medium is the message, what's the message of Digital?
Feel free to answer those questions in their appropriate landings in our conversation. Derek, in 2004 you and Wayne Pethrick wrote Future Frequencies (https://www.amazon.com/Future-Frequencies-Derek-Woodgate/dp/0970710402) and we had the pleasure of interviewing you both here on Inkwell.vue (topic#238). That was only 12 and a half years ago, which in space time does not seem like much, but in tech time is huge. So much has happened since then - the advent of Social Media, the Stacks, video conferencing as an everyday occurrence. How have all these new digital tools and platforms augmented your work in Future Frequencies?
It is 13 years since Future Frequencies hit the book stands with its rather progressive approach to what we then all termed futures studies and is now more commonly referred to as foresight. Apparently, it was paradigm shifting for the futurists' community at the time and has led to the birth of both new modeling techniques, increased rhizomatic thinking approaches and the integration of digital tools and applications hitherto very difficult to muster. Now in our 21 year, The Futures Lab has had to both adapt to the new complexities surrounding a somewhat different client base, who themselves have become significantly more adaptive, knowledgable about future potential and expecting a more tech heavy delivery of futures outcomes and recommendations as well as being able to dip in and out of the process using collaborative tools and virtual working environment. A glance at our employee skills today tells us how much I myself have had to transform my activities and thinking techniques, while others join and are integrated based upon a whole new set of tech and other 21st C skills that include: Sense making, computational and rhizomatic thinking, emotional design, cognitive interaction, transmedia literacy, trans-culture, transdisciplinarity, social-motivated creativity, etc. Foresight is In my opinion, requires both computational linear reasoning and transformative thinking approaches, even intuition and a heavy dose of creativity. As Heinlein says One man's engineering is another man's magic. To this end, we have seen the ability to use predictive analysis; and the ability to cluster big data sets of potential influences through advanced diagnostics and analysis. Systems thinking is now a basic tool that is far easier to manage with computational design than even the systems modeling we were doing long-hand 10 years ago. There is also the ability for advanced environmental scanning and pattern recognition that I discussed in detail in Future Frequencies, when we were already building 3D worlds and amorphoscapes that helped plot potential future horizons. Now we really can follow my phrase "Think like a DJ", because it is far easier to build potential future opportunities frameworks from a variety of disconnects and then deconstruct their elements and reconstruct with new perspectives and with contrary contextual values like upside down world thinking. Another mapping technique is to take DJ Spooky's thinking of understanding the spaces in between the rhythms by focusing on the potential scenarios that could arise from those spaces. We have so many more options with computational applications to foresight, not to mention emerging visualization techniques and the way we deliver future scenarios and platforms. These are unrecognizable from the old style "Day i a Life" or traditional narrative based scenarios. Gaming and video have reconceptualized narrative. VR and AR overlays allow us to create the future encounter in real virtuality - more or less full immersion, so that we can experience the scenario and iots potential impact, whether it is product-based or concept-based. Foresight is now about foreXperience. Our subsidiary, The FutureXperience Lab enables us to demonstrate those potential futures in quasi reality. The other advantage is that TFL's network is so much more technologically enhanced than in the past, whether it is the ability to collaborate with the universities or with the labs at the clients themselves. Given that I teach at both Georgia State University and the University of Adger in Norway, I am lucky enough to test certain future concepts both in our interaction and learning labs or through my students. Social media platforms have changed the way we do concept research and while we still undertake our f2f Frontline Panels of mixed experts, we are are able to supplement these by setting up highly effective on-line multi-country participant workshops. So clients expect more from us in terms of technology infused foresight, but we are looking all the time to make our already complex programs more robust, with demonstrations of multiple potential outcomes.
Jaron Lanier has a new book out, Dawn of the New Everything (https://www.amazon.com/Dawn-New-Everything-Encounters-Reality/dp/1627794093). Always worth reading anything by the godfather of VR. He had a blurb in Wired this month, Reenter the Matrix, so I can't resist a quote or two: "Do you see VR and AR as separate? (his response) "I think the relationship between them is similar to the relationship between film and television: They come through the same streams to the same devices, yet they're still distinct. They have distinct cultures, they're made in different ways, we have different expectations of them." "What's a definition of virtual reality that you hope we ultimately end up with?" "A cross between music and perception"
Hi, and thanks to Ted for having me. The view here in the Emirates is truly a futurist one, with our adopting the Blockchain for our governmental document flow, out first-ever Minister of Artificial Intelligence, and our design district being a futuristic setting for Imagine Dragons Thunder video. I live in applied VR every day, so I appreciate being in this conversation. To start things off, I was given two questions, and the others have already jumped in. Being that is it the National Day/Martyrs Day long weekend, Im able to sit down for a more in depth conversation. As a creative and artist how do see the present digital tool kit augmenting your 'world' and work? As a practitioner of digital art of almost 30 years now, I have a long view of this. What I think is most exciting about the current set of tools is the breadth of possibilities; hardware, software, immersion, fabrication, UX I take this as an explication of the massive production of ideas from the Long Tail feeding back into the enabled technoculture. For example, as the animator of the activist group The Yes Men over its first ten years, I think that we were a harbinger of the current day the use of media authoring to profoundly shape reality. For example, we have always tried to show a world we would like to see; one of peace, humanity, and progressive general welfare. However, art technology used in the service of politics can be used for anyone. When James OKeefe performed his intervention on NPR, it was clear that media technological tactics were coopted by the right. Although I have a definite perspective, I dont want to center there, but to merely respond to Ted in saying that things have gotten squishy. This has been pretty obvious for a while, but with the fantastic tools in play today, simulated realities are increasingly easy, and as long as the notion of reality bubbles in social media and elsewhere increases to intensify, we have the danger of having localized subjective realities that are indistinguishable from objective reality. Example: I had a student here in the UAE highly educated woman; we spoke for a couple hours about Sartre, Dadaism, Kitaro Nishidas notions of Zen Existentialism and Nothingness, and then she offhandedly asked about the US propaganda regarding the reality of the Apollo Program, because Kubrick filmed all that, right? This is no offense to her, but what has come about in the aestheticized era of reality is that, given reality tools, which is my medium, reality itself becomes aestheticized. While this, the s quishiness of the objective with the digital subjective, is where I live, when you have eventual life and death models like climate change, population explosions, etc., we have to be intentional with reality tools as not to abstract objective reality further as to not represent a singularly Western model. We are almost on an annual revolution cycle now. I got a chance to meet Israel at the Augmented World Expo conference this year, and I agree that we are on the way to a next evolution in production, and I would mention, creativity. And I would like to balance The Fourth Revolution as a useful Convergence/Singularity-like point of discussion, the past two examples being other revolutionary models used for capturing the publics attention, re Kellys The Next Big Thing. This is how we are in technoculture. We are magicians. Building from Clarkes Third Law, in that Technology, sufficiently advanced, becomes Indistinguishable from Magic, and that makes us Magicians. However, in the Long View, there have been a string of Revolutions; for example, my students asked me in 2010 why I had not told them about developing for the iPad It had not existed when they enrolled. My colleague and I are, in fact, writing essays on on-the-fly and ad hoc pedagogy in light of rapid technological change. To ground what might seem like a rambling conversation, artists are forward observers (as McLuhan saw so aptly), and they are ones who can, can show the issues of technoculture most clearly, and I think that this is the most exciting part of being an artist in this time, as I have building a cybernetic labor farm for the creation of my drawings as an example. And, secondly, what does the future look like for you, with regards to VR/MR/AR? Im, as I usually am, extremely excited and ambivalent, which I feel is healthy. Hearing Sheikh Mohammed bin Rashid al Makhtoum, Ruler of Dubai mention that VR/AR are central to the future of Dubai and the World Expo, as well as spending time at the Dubai Future Foundation and going to house parties with the Hyperloop Engineering Team says to me that the future is a given here in the UAE. The Louvre is a Gibsonian take on the original institution, and shows again that reality is terribly squishy. Between myself as an artist and as a futurist, I respect Scoble and Israels vision for what I call the Next Singularity (Fourth Revolution), and I think it is an exciting place for creatives. For example the new Adobe Sensei tools will accelerate stylistic consistency for designers using natural learning algorithms. As I see AI and the Blockchain fitting into the Reality Ecologies, commerce, aesthetics, and creative production will expand exponentially. However, I wonder about the outcomes as VR is eventually niched by AR, which will utterly outpace VR in the coming years. What are the key artworks of the coming years? My picks lately are Alex Rebens Deeply Artificial Trees, and Keiichi Matsudas Hyperreality. Both show a break from reality that seems absurd, but as Ted said earlier, what seems incredible today is commonplace tomorrow. It is an amazing and humbling thing to be a creative at the apex of human civilization.
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permalink #6 of 49: Derek Woodgate (woodgate) Thu 30 Nov 17 13:11
permalink #6 of 49: Derek Woodgate (woodgate) Thu 30 Nov 17 13:11
Sadly, I missed you in UAE. I spent last week in Abu Dhabi meeting with the Deputy Prime Minister/Minister for the Interior and the chiefs of police from Dubai and Abu Dhabi discussing the future of policing. Now I am at a conference in Budapest presenting on the future of AI and of course in both cases we discussed predictive security, third eye surveillance with drones and IOT/living architecture in urban environments, coupled with the use of CCTV as art and data sculptures that provide both physical and cognitive feedback. Of course, we spoke of the role of sensor swarms and networks that could feedback the life of the city for planning and adaptive design to improve the community well-being, but also device driven interactive environments with AR overlays that help distribute the city's real-time narrative.The interactive role of art and the city is a topic that I thrive on. I am a great friend and fan of STANZA (wwww.stanza.co.uk) and his work such as The Nemesis Machine From Metropolis to Megalopolis to Ecumenopolis.
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permalink #7 of 49: Derek Woodgate (woodgate) Thu 30 Nov 17 14:19
permalink #7 of 49: Derek Woodgate (woodgate) Thu 30 Nov 17 14:19
Turning to Scoble and Israel's The Fourth Transformation: How Augmented Reality & Artificial Intelligence Will Change Everything. AlpharGo Zero's recent achievement may prove to be a true representation of discontinuous change in terms of the march towards generalized artificial intelligence. Amazing that except from programming in the Rules, there were no human inputs and consequently no human thinking constraints. Although the recent group of nine wise men including Kurzweil and Talinn and Musk, Bostrom and co. felt that GAI was still a way off, but still achievable within Kurzweil's 2035 prediction in the Age of Spiritual Machines, some 20 years ago, the recent accelerated progress means in my view that we should be already thinking beyond a purely human-centric world and begin to consider issues such as intelligence mutuality, future co-creativity, etc. Much will depend upon AI designer progress in the area of intangibles (emotional intelligence and cognitive aspects. I am of the opinion that AI will self-generate many of these traits through trial and error and will achieve higher cognitive skills in ways that we will not understand. One of the topics I spoke on yesterday was "Think like an AI DJ' - a take on my usual TLADJ rant. Beyond fears of killerbots, algorithm warfare and crytocurrency corruption, we should focus our thinking on how to create benevolent applications together with AI agents that begin to answer questions around curing future diseases and reducing energy consumption, etc. We need a lot of discussion on roboethics and containing dominance by any one party.
Good Gopod! (Our term for a higher power) Only seven responses in and there is so much material. I'm overwhelmed and awed by you two. Derek, as you read Patrick's posts, what jumps out at you? Patrick, same question about Derek;s posts. Derek and Patrick, Reality/reality? My joke is that nothing, subjectively or objectively is in capital letters anymore. Most of the time I feel like I am living in one of Rudy Rucker's cyberpunk worlds. We are redefining everything, while adding AI and robots to the mix. Truly a "-brave New world". It is refreshing to sense the excitement and deep understanding you both have for this time and space in which we so fortunately find ourselves. You both have alluded to the new skill sets all the 'players bring to the table. The learning curve, alone, can be overwhelming. Derek, corporations now have C-Suite Knowledge Officers and internal knowledge gardens for their employees to develop. This question is for both of you. Do you have your own Personal Learning Networks, in a structured way, or a mix of intuitive/deductive toolkits that work for you. Have they been cobbled together, a bit like a patchwork quilt, or do you find software and platforms that do the job?
Also, I would like to talk about the elephant in the room - the white boys club. You both travel the world. Is it getting better? Is there a growing mix of cultures, subcultures, men and women, young and old? How have you seen this change over the years. Are women cracking thru the glass ceiling? What's your take on the "politics" of tech and the changing dynamics between coders, programmers, creative's, managers, owners and content producers? What kind of ecosystem is out there?
We have a few geeks here in the WELL. Please feel free to jump in. It should already be clear that there is so much content here that this will not be a linear conversation. I could use some help panning for all the gold :) Non-geeks are also most certainly welcome. Every opinion and perspective is helpful. This technological transformation is impacting all of our lives, all of our realities. I will give us a day or two to talk about this among ourselves and then invite folks from off-Well to participate.
Note to readers: post #5 was sent to Ted via email by Patrick Lichty.
"... we spoke of the role of sensor swarms and networks that could feedback the life of the city for planning and adaptive design to improve the community well-being..." Could just as readily provide a platform for surveillance and control, I would think.
This, from Patrick really jumps out for me: > we have the > danger of having localized subjective realities that are > indistinguishable from objective reality. It strikes me that Alex Reben's "Deeply Artificial Trees" can be interpreted as a reminder that even our most personal 'objective reality' is actually the product of a somewhat chaotic process of trial-and-error pattern matching, constantly taking place just below the level of conscious awareness.
Yup, squishy ;)
re #13....this seems even more so given the advent of digital realities...which loops back to Elon Musk's comments at the beginning. What does everyone think about this fractal reality, as James Bridle like to call it; The blend of IRL, virtual, mediated or mixed and augmented?
My grandchildren don't seem to give it a thought, they just roll with it...is this an 'old dog' issue?
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Patrick responds: Hi Ted and Derek! I agree with Ted in that there is so much to chew on, and were just getting started. In regards to Teds comments regarding my reflections on Dereks, I playfully feel I should be consulting far more than I do; I tend to be an academic/media commentator who occasionally deals with policy. I should be far more engaged with this sector. Thinking about Dereks interstitial approach i.e. Think Like an AI DJ there is a big challenge in the contemporary age. We can use predictive indicators to get a lay of the land, but the scope of the landscape has been growing exponentially as technoculture (and I dare to possibly say Innovation) increases. There is a point in the 1990s where science fiction became near-future speculation, and colleagues like Salvatore Iaconesi, Oriana Persico, and Bruce Sterling have been pioneering NF Design strategies. Therefore, the person invested in the future is deeply involved in surfing, looking for lacunae, dodging walls and grabbing disruptive technologies. This is not to say that we should trust technology. Thinking about this, I have embedded within my soul a recording from the early 90s by a group called Earwax productions called Virtual Paradise, which features Terrence McKenna and my friend Brenda Laurel and many others. It has vignettes talking about VR, talking about what you want to do with it, from Terrences musing on concrete language, to dark fantasies in the irreal. One part has a refrain, You cant stop it! Its a very large juggernaut running out of control Humanity has this illusion of control; there probably no such thing; just degrees of contingency we can manage. But with heads like Elon at the helm of world innovation, I would like to think that we are not solely at the mercy of technological determination and market dynamics. There are heads of reason at the top who are calling to not just let the bus drive itself, as we build buses that do drive themselves. We are at the point now where humanity is geoengineering the planet, and its the market that is doing it it is a function of blind intent, but the fact that it exists shows we can control that. What I see with AI, AlphaOne, etc. are a few curves that we need to look at. Automation is at the intersection of labor and return on investment (ROI) and in many cases there is capital concentration, wage disparity, delaboring. With a booming population here in the Eastern Hemisphere, there is a gorilla in the room; certainly. Artificial intelligence and efficient learning protocols versus mass labor of brute force. Where I see things heading in the next 10-20 years is when value is finally drained from the labor pool. And AI (sic) is sort of a First World issue that is being placed on the emerging countries. This has strange effects, like communications leapfrogging as you have largely illiterate populations vigorously using Facebook (Nigeria), and cell nets totally leapfrogging POTS technology in Southeast Asia. As I sit in a country obsessed with its own sustainability, I think the UAE should rightly be concerned with this. While I tend to be a bit neutral in my assessment of automation except in matters like weaponization of AI (which I feel should be strictly outlawed) I see that the linkage of Ai, Automation and the markets will necessitate new markets that are radically unlike those today, and perhaps that is where Bitcoin/Blockchain will come in. More on that later, as Id like to devote an entire missive to that, as Ive been a fly on the wall to conversations with the Government of Dubai and their converting their document stream entirely to Blockchain tech. But in the end, I think responsible voices need to be thinking at the meta scale in terms that are not merely accelerating technology for its own sake, as over half the world is not, by our standards, technological. Solutions need to be created which are human in scope, or perhaps Gaian, and not just technological. In the end, the following will be true: Life must be cared for. The Earth is a closed system with Malthusian limits. How can we use AI to account for this, and will we listen if it says something politicians and captains of industry do/dont want to hear? What are the effects of mediation and AI on the world populations? How do artists address these messages? Are we doing it already?
re #18 <Therefore, the person invested in the future is deeply involved in surfing, looking for lacunae, dodging walls and grabbing disruptive technologies.> On the mark! Sometimes I think I'm surfing the tecnocurve, other times creating it, and other times about to be wiped out by the tsunami of it...all good :) <here are heads of reason at the top who are calling to not just let the bus drive itself, as we build buses that do drive themselves. We are at the point now where humanity is geoengineering the planet, and its the market that is doing it it is a function of blind intent, but the fact that it exists shows we can control that.> That's a very optimistic view Patrick....Derek, how do you see it all?
#18 (dont) < With a booming population here in the Eastern Hemisphere, there is a gorilla in the room; certainly. Artificial intelligence and efficient learning protocols versus mass labor of brute force. Where I see things heading in the next 10-20 years is when value is finally drained from the labor pool.> I was thinking yesterday that the AI's and Robots need a union....they just don't 'know' it yet!
"when value is "finally" drained from the labor pool" I would want to rephrase that a bit....from the labor pool that exists at the present time....there are a lot of new kids on the block, coming up.. I think we won't see clearly until today's 7 year olds have taken the reins....and given their development, that could well start by the time they are 10!! But most certainly by the time they are 17. So, for me, the next 10 years is an opportunity for teachers, parents, grandparents and significant others to establish strong ties with these kids. It is their future and world after all. We are just along for the ride. Magic Bus indeed!!
<I see that the linkage of Ai, Automation and the markets will necessitate new markets that are radically unlike those today, and perhaps that is where Bitcoin/Blockchain will come in. More on that later, as Id like to devote an entire missive to that, as Ive been a fly on the wall to conversations with the Government of Dubai and their converting their document stream entirely to Blockchain tech.> Yup, plenty of gorillas to go around...and as David says: Too Big to Know: Rethinking Knowledge Now That the Facts Aren't the Facts, Experts Are Everywhere, and the Smartest Person in the Room Is the Room by David Weinberger (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/11581907-too-big-to-know) This boundless cyberspace, or digital universe is the territory which this driverless bus navigates....whoopee, and you don't need a ticket to get on board, just any old connection will do; lo-fi, mesh, etc.
Reading Jaron Lanier's newest Dawn of the New Everything: Encounters with Reality and Virtual Reality. (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071RBPV1V/ref=oh_aui_d_detailpage_o02_?ie=U TF8&psc=1) Great mix of history, vignettes, and deep thinking about the future of humanity and tech. He humorously gives some 50 plus definitions of VR as the book rolls along; generally riffing off of science, jazz and cinema metaphors and concludes that MR is where it is at in the short run....still a lot of development to be done on the various delivery tools for VR to be ready for mass market. So, Mixed it is! For now. ;)
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permalink #24 of 49: Derek Woodgate (woodgate) Tue 5 Dec 17 12:27
permalink #24 of 49: Derek Woodgate (woodgate) Tue 5 Dec 17 12:27
So having lost an hour's text, having been interrupted by beauty, I'll start again. I mentioned earlier that we need to be seeing our world as one which is not only human-centric. Beyond the issues of mutual intelligibility and role reconfiguration, we need to develop a new paradigm that provides a framework even a new schema for how we deal with the interplay between humans, transhumans and non-humans and parallel realities in terms of everything from interfaces, language, intelligences, cultural attitudes, identities, etc. Single but differing lifeworlds will ensue and we will need to break the categorical schema by which we currently frame ascertain and understand the intricacies of world order. Will non-humans have archetypes? Certainly they will be have aa sense of hierarchy, even if it is not in terms of the awareness humans expunge now. Human input data hierarchy is obviously a given, but self-generating AI will develop its own integrity. All three elements (human, transhuman and non-human will expect recognition. This will require a new layer of cultural transformation. As Bruno Latour believes, material objects need to be included in social analysis. We already have wearables that understand tone of voice and plenty of IoT with situation awareness through programmable surfaces, therefore cognitive interaction. AI will develop cognitive in its own way and its interpretation of what is a "soul" and how it plays out will be intuitive to the AI rather than understandable to other other than maybe technically. Transcribing algorithms into cognitive behavior that are understandable to humans, but purely performative in terms of the way they are generated by AI will be a major challenge. So think of the role of an HR professional in the future. The complexities of shared responsibilities, skill validation, evaluation and determination will make shared labor or project/task structures difficult to valorize. The opportunities for intellectual advancement through human, transhuman, non-human collaboration are enormous, but many see AI bringing in a new level of intellectual retreat. The parallel realities I mentioned earlier are critical to the division and valorization of labor. AI subsets like machine learning, once they re self-generating and self-directing are developing in their own "body", humans and potentially transhumans when working in mixedmedia environments while somewhat disempowering reality, will create a simulation of a new body of labor. It will be critical to map the likely imperious rise of one of the three manifestations of the "body". Later I would like to discuss how these potential redefinitions of "body" are reflected in perspectives of our reality being simply a simulation.
Derek, marvelous. Thank you for that consice recap. Would you expand a bit on "integrity"; particularly your definition of the word. And is that definition all inclusive for humans,transhuman,AI, and post-human (should Kurzweil prove right)!
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