inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1776 of 1922: public service squeak (miss-mousey) Tue 30 Mar 04 22:20
    
Just an FYI. It appears that Marvel 1602 has been pushed back and will
*not* arrive tomorrow AM as planned. I believe the new release date is
April 14.

Please feel free to pass the word along so Neil doesn't get *quite* so
bombarded in his FAQ line.

-squeaks
who was rather annoyed by the news
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1777 of 1922: Pamela Basham (pamela-bird) Wed 31 Mar 04 14:54
    
Will, that was beautiful all the way through.  I loved the transition
to "For Cynthia" from forsythias.

I think I'm currently dealing with the idea that risk is omnipresent,
and that this isn't a reason to stop.  Navigate a little more slowly,
maybe, sometimes, but never stop.

But euphoria... euphoria scares the daylights out of me.  Well, one
thing at a time.

Christy: I'd love to see the D.DC. cherry blossoms sometime. 
Something of the frustrated hopes we all feel about our government in
that.  Pictures?

Squeaks: Stripes! Yay, stripey cake!  (*little worried frown* Thing-E
*will* be kept somewhere *quite* far from the cake, won't she?)
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1778 of 1922: I may have confused you with "boiled meat". (tinymonster) Wed 31 Mar 04 16:51
    
April 14??  Sigh -- I guess I'll just have to think of it as a
slightly early birthday present.  :)

Pam -- I shall see what I can do.  :)  I actually have some pictures
from 1999 that I am quite proud of; maybe someday I'll bribe someone
with a scanner and get them up there in pixels.  (Shrugs sheepishly) 
I'm afraid they're not political statements, though.  Just flowers.

Stayed home sick today, but my mother was scheduled to drop by and
pick up some things.  So she got to see me unexpectedly, and I got
shopped for and fed.  :)  Off to get my chicken and stuffing dinner out
of the oven.

-Christy, drinking green tea
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1779 of 1922: Will Entrekin (willentrekin) Thu 1 Apr 04 05:37
    
Tiny- hope you feel better!

Pam- glad you liked it.  And agree about risk, but risk is one of the
best things about life, sometimes.  Or maybe just for me, anyway.  I'll
be 26 in a month, I have health insurance, a decent, pretty secure
job, and it scares me.  This doesn't feel like my life.  It's so
paradoxical; I'm a Taurus, we're supposed to be all stable, and such,
but then, once I get stable, I get restless.
Odd.  I think part of it is the search.  I don't feel like I've found
any answers, and I'm still not where I want to be with writing, but,
then, I'm doin' okay, most of the time.

I suppose it's a matter of risk.  It's nice to be safe, yeah, and the
boat in the harbor may be, but, eventually, it's bottom's gonna rot
out.  It might have been Emerson who said that to be a great explorer,
you must, at times, allow yourself to lose sight of the shore you know.
If it wasn't Emerson, it should've been.  It's a very Emerson sort of
thing to say.

My roommate from college called me last night at 4 in the morning.  It
was one o'clock, his time, and it was his drunken phone call.  He was
surprised I picked up, asked why on earth I leave my cell phone on when
I'm asleep, but, well, I figure, if he's in jail, well, that's a
pretty big emergency, and that's why I got the phone.
He wasn't in jail.  He was in L.A. in the Dresden room.  It's where a
scene in *Swingers* was set, and it reminded him of me, so he called me
to remind me how money I am.  He's going to be a doctor in a few short
weeks, finished the path we both started, eight years ago.
I'm not a doctor.  I realized it early in.  But I wish I were in L.A. 
I'm safe, I have insurance, I'm doin' okay.  But I feel like there's
somethin' more I'm just missin'.
Maybe it's time to take some more risks.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1780 of 1922: I may have confused you with "boiled meat". (tinymonster) Thu 1 Apr 04 11:25
    
(Thanks for the wishes, Will!)
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1781 of 1922: Adriana Roze (ariadne26) Fri 2 Apr 04 09:32
    
I live two blocks from the Dresden!  I'll remember to think of you,
too!
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1782 of 1922: Pamela Basham (pamela-bird) Fri 2 Apr 04 11:57
    
Christy: Belated wishes for wellness.

Will: The actual quote is, I believe, from Andre Gide:

"One doesn't discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of
the shore for a very long time."

More info on Gide at: http://www.andregide.org/

I love that quote.

And I think you're right.  The boat's perfectly safe in the harbor,
but that's not what a boat is for.  And, as you said, eventually, the
bottom will rot out.

Maybe you have a more adventurous rising sign, like Aries, or
something.  

The thing about me is that I never seem to remain in any harbor for
very long, no matter how I cling to the tie line.  But then, I rarely
seem to end up where I think I'm heading, either.  Life's very strange.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1783 of 1922: Will Entrekin (willentrekin) Fri 2 Apr 04 12:45
    
Gide it is.  Woops.  And I think my ascendant's in Gemini.

As for restless... I think I'm going to apply to USC for a Master's. 
I really only want to write, don't want to study it, don't want to
teach it, but I figure, that'll give me a couple of years during which
I *have* to, for classes and whatnot, and I'd like that.
Because *just wanting* to write, most times, it's simply ain't enough.
 There's got to be a Can't Not aspect to it, really.

Adriana- please do!  I think of you all the time, when I play your CD,
so it would be only fair, really (although I'm still mad at you, I'll
admit, for the muppet e-mail I once got that didn't actually have any
muppet info in it.  Curse you for getting my hopes up, curse you!  Do
you think you can just toy with my emotions like that [well.  You're
probably right.  You probably can.  Most girls do, in fact.]).
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1784 of 1922: I may have confused you with "boiled meat". (tinymonster) Fri 2 Apr 04 15:14
    
Thanks for the well-wishes, Pam!

Well, who knew Alan Moore is one of the Legion of Substitute Neils.

And I know what I said in my introductory post to this group
(<inkwell.vue.144.689> -- see the first paragraph I addressed
specifically to Neil), but I never quite expected to see it prove
literally true!

But honestly, Neil, an Englishman asking for teabags?  There just
seems to be something wrong with that.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1785 of 1922: Will Entrekin (willentrekin) Fri 2 Apr 04 19:21
    
So, I have a question; how come I didn't know *Heat of Fusion and
other stories* came out last month?  I know Mike Ford used to be on
here... no longer the case?
Now I have to make a Barnes & Noble run.  And I promised myself I'd
try to save money for a while.  D'oh.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1786 of 1922: Christy Smith (tinymonster) Mon 5 Apr 04 07:46
    <scribbled>
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1787 of 1922: A quite well-educated Grover with an undoubtedly unorthodox opinion (tinymonster) Mon 5 Apr 04 08:01
    
Aww, c'mon, Neil, leave the *private* schools alone, willya?

Although I am sort of surprised to see a university in San Francisco
setting any sort of limits on anything, *especially* an art school.

Will --
> Now I have to make a Barnes & Noble run.

Aww, rats.  ;)

I've still got a little left over on my Border's card.  I'm planning
to pounce on _Mr. Punch_ as soon as I can find one that hasn't been
torn already.

nr:  _A Wind in the Door_, Madeleine L'Engle (and, unexpectedly,
liking it even better than _A Wrinkle in Time_)

Re-posted for missing punctuation.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1788 of 1922: Will Entrekin (willentrekin) Mon 5 Apr 04 08:23
    
I loved the *Wrinkle in Time* trilogy.  I remember I read *A Swiftly
Tilting Planet* and loved how much it reminded me of *Quantum Leap*.
I need to re-read those.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1789 of 1922: Dodge (clotildes) Mon 5 Apr 04 10:37
    
Back from vacation. Totally wasted vacation days, too. But spring was
nice. Monday I had to cancel the vacation day because my boss wanted
something for a meeting on Tuesday and had totally forgotten I was
going on vacation. Tuesday went to a doctor for some tummy problems.
Wednesday. Not sure what happened to Wed. Do you ever have those days
off where you don't seem to get anything done and don't in fact
remember the day much at all? That was Wed. Thursday morning went with
my fave garden pals out to my fave nursery and it was a wonderful
spring day and I got a rose bush for my patio as well as some plants
for under the lilies and stuff on the pots. Friday I had to go into the
hospital for an icky test where they put a camera down your throat.
And my doctor yelled at me because I didn't check into the correct
place but REALLY his staff did NOT tell me where exactly to go. Really.
They didn't. Saturday was helping a pal with a garage sale where I sat
and wondered how I got myself into this when I had so much to do else
where but, you know, promised. Sunday didn't feel good and slept most
of the day. So. wasted vacation. My house still isn't in order from the
move. Sigh. I accomplished one thing. Hung the kitchen curtain rod but
the curtains I used I don't like cept I haven't found the ones I want
to put up there yet.

But I'm back to work today and everything is ok and I think I'll take
my vacation days one at a time if I'm going to use them to unpack.
There's just something about having plenty of time that makes you not
use it wisely. 

Went to the store and didn't find the next issue. Well, will wait now
till April 14th. 
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1790 of 1922: I may have confused you with "boiled meat". (tinymonster) Mon 5 Apr 04 12:50
    
Welcome back!
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1791 of 1922: the squeaky (miss-mousey) Mon 5 Apr 04 18:17
    
But Christy, it may be a private school, but it's masquerading as an
art school... in SAN FRANCISCO. Now, I have friends that have graduated
from there, and it's well and goodly true that there is art taught at
the school, but as a general rule AASF is a place that teaches you how
to use your art to make a living with it. They prep you for work in
advertising and web design and such - practical usage - not necessarily
promoting the 'explore your artistic side' approach. My big problem
with the school is that it likes calling itself an 'art school', when
really that's kind of a side effect. And because it likes to call
itself an ART school, I take issue with the censorship. 

The institution's hypocrisy is just unnerving. You can't call yourself
an art university and then censor anything you don't like - private or
no. If you want to censor the work, then you should not promote
yourself as an art school, but as some sort of training institute.

-squeaks
who wishes she didn't have to be at work on Wednesday (no one to fill
in) so she could rally at the AA.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1792 of 1922: Dodge (clotildes) Tue 6 Apr 04 07:22
    
Now. Before I say anything, I want y'all to understand that I'm as
against censorship as any of you and I agree that a school calling
itself an art school shouldn't be doing these things BUT
ON the otherhand, if they are teaching NOT art per se but how to be a
marketable artist, then it sort of makes sense. To appeal to the masses
you have to supply what the masses are looking for. With few if any
controversial components. You can't know how I hate saying that but I
worked in an art school here in Houston and this was a subject hotly
debated. Reality is that if you want to make it just starting out as a
new artist and actually be able to pay bills with your art, you have to
give what the buyers are looking for. Your 'other' art (read - the
stuff you care about) can be saved for those who will appreciate it.
And remember that the students' fees are often paid by more
conservative parents. That was also something we had to deal with. We
couldn't allow certains types of art in the portfolios due to the fact
the parents got quite vociferous over it. Nudes, sexual, or drug
related images couldn't be included. And it doesn't have to be those
things that cause problems. Religious imagery or political satire and
such can cause major problems with parents and public. So, yeah, we
taught the students that you do what you can sell and keep the rest for
your personal gallery sales.

It's that same old dichotomy anyone artistic has to face. Do I not
'sell out' or do I eat?
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1793 of 1922: Will Entrekin (willentrekin) Tue 6 Apr 04 07:41
    
I was in a situation remarkably like that (well.  Somewhat similar to
it, at any rate).  I was the editor of our school's literary magazine,
and one of the students submitted an artwork that showed female nudity.
 Our faculty advisor took one look at it and decided it wasn't
appropriate, and then it got a half-assed vote (i.e., a couple of
people looked at it and say 'nay', and that was about it).
I didn't think it was being treated fairly and, myself, wanted to
include it.  So I went to our college president with the material in
question, and he said, sorry, can't do anything about it, that's not in
my hands.
It got to be a truly complicated situation.  I went to a Jesuit
college, it was a private liberal arts institution, and people felt it
wasn't in line with the college's mission to publish such a thing, and
I argued, no, the college's mission is to serve us, its students, and
teach us to make our own decisions, educate us so that we know what
we're talking about, so that we can take a step and step boldly.  So my
step is this; I will compromise with you.  We put the work in question
to a proper vote, including everyone who worked, in however small a
way, on the magazine.  If it gets voted in but you decide we still
can't publish it, well, then, you can find yourself a new editor (that
would've totally screwed them.  I had all the files, and had already
done all the lay-out, on my desktop.  They would've had to start all
over, minus both all the work I'd done and all my work that had made it
in).
Given a fair vote, it was not included.  That I didn't mind.  It was
given the same treatment as all the other work in the magazine.
The artist wasn't happy with the decision, and pulled both the piece
in question and all her other material (which I thought was a bit
unprofessional, I'd worked hard to get her a fair forum and then she
reacted rather petulantly, if you ask me).
In my head, I can understand the whole "they're a private institution
so they can do whatever they want".  But you can't hide behind being
private and still try to be bold enough to be an arts institution.  Art
is about boldness, about having the voice to say the things that
haven't been said yet, and sometimes there's a very good reason those
things haven't been said.  It never matters, not for an artist, an
artist has to say what they've been given to say, nothing more and
nothing less.
At my place of business, they have some sort of rule where they won't
hire members of immediate family.  My brother cannot work here, because
I do.  However, the daughters of the vice president *both* work here
(and one only started a couple of weeks ago).  I understood their point
about nepotism until they went against everything they told me.
It's silly, and it loses them all respect in my eyes.  Just like that
university.

(slipped by Dodge), to which I say, why can't you do both?  I don't
understand the idea that it's either artistic integrity or commercial
success, and neither the twain shall meet.  Okay, fine, some books that
make the best-seller's list are crap, but *The Lovely Bones* is an
excellent novel, a very good work of art.  So's *American Gods*.
Metallica cut their hair and put out *Load*, which is my favorite
album of theirs.  They turned down the volume a little and you could
finally actually hear that they were semi-decent musicians, that they
were doing something they cared about.  Did they sell out?  Yep.  Every
album, every seat, every show, every time, and they sold out of
something they believed in.
That ain't so bad, I don't think.
I think it's a faulty argument, and I don't think it's nearly as bad
as all that.  I think, if you write a good story you believe in, or
paint a pretty picture or play a song people can dance to, I think
you're gonna be just fine.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1794 of 1922: Dodge (clotildes) Tue 6 Apr 04 09:08
    
I agree with you on the doing both part but that's a hard hard line to
balance on. And no matter how many works you get out into the public
under that balance, there are almost as many sitting quietly against a
wall in a closet that you know the general public isn't quite ready
for. Works that will have to go to certain specialized places to be
sold. 

I mean, even Neil has some things I've read that I know didn't get out
to the mainline like American Gods did. 
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1795 of 1922: the squeaky (and slightly bouncy) (miss-mousey) Wed 7 Apr 04 20:34
    
It is a fine line to place and an easy one to cross. I understand the
school's need to censor stuff like that (though I don't agree with it
in the slightest), when you consider that they're trying to train kids
to use their art in the "real world"... I'm just ticked at the way they
present themselves as an art school, when really that's not the whole
story. Any way, I'm less angsty about it today, and am settled into a
just slightly uncomfortable "yeah? well, screw them" sort of attitude
when people bother to bring it up.

In the meantime, I'm marveling at a cat who's all squished & sleeping
behind my keyboard, and NOT attacking the ribbons hanging from my
garland (not sure who to thank for this miracle, but there it is).

-squeaks
who is also marvelling at the number of distant relatives who say
their going to the wedding... who are these people and what have they
done with our *real* families?
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1796 of 1922: Dodge (clotildes) Thu 8 Apr 04 07:05
    
You mean the real family who say loudly and to anyone that will listen
that they are not coming because they disagree with the color of your
flowers when you know really it was the fact that they don't get along
with good ol' unca sonso who provided them to you free? Or the real
family that you actually remember telling about the wedding and your
granma doesn't have to go through who's daughter's son's cousin's
sister's boy that person there is. 
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1797 of 1922: I may have confused you with "boiled meat". (tinymonster) Thu 8 Apr 04 15:04
    
Will, THANK you for admitting to liking _Load_.  I usually hear it
reviled essentially *because* it did so well, but I've always liked it,
too, at least from what I've heard of it.  James actually has a nice
voice.  I think it's kind of funny:  In middle school, you're only
"cool" if you like what's popular.  From college on, you're only "cool"
if you DON'T like what's popular.

(And I'm getting the feeling that somewhere, there is a universally
adopted, uniform, hard-coded definition of "art school" that they don't
tell engineering majors about.)

Neil -- The song stuff is about the farthest you can get from dull, at
least for me!  I still think it's so cool that you can do that stuff,
along with all your other talents.  It's just... wow.

Neil just makes me happy from all different directions.  :)

Off to go to the DC Improv.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1798 of 1922: Will Entrekin (willentrekin) Thu 8 Apr 04 18:13
    
Shoot, *admit* to it?  I *love* *Load*.  *Hero of the Day* is the best
song Metallica ever produced.  Followed by *King Nothing,* and then
*Until It Sleeps*.  All of which are on *Load*, surprise.

As far as art goes, integrity versus success... I don't know about
this argument.  I have it internally all the time.  I saw Bowie last
week, who's established both, I'd say.  But it's a harder line to make
when talking books, and writing.  Most of the best-sellers (*The
DaVinci Code* ad naus) really aren't all that terrific.  John Grisham
keeps writing the same damned book, over and over.  So does Danielle
Steele.
But, honestly, (well, I can't say about Steele, I've never read her),
I think the key is storytelling.  If you can tell a story, and tell it
well, I think, chances are, you'll be successful.  Grisham can tell a
story and a half.  Reading *Harry Potter* is like freebasing story, and
those books are just about that addictive.  Stephen King... again,
story.
The best writers are the ones who can tell you a story and tell you
something *besides* the story *at the very same time*.  They're the
ones who transcend.  There aren't many, no, but when it happens, it's
just magical.

My favorite artist in the world is Roger Clyne.  He used to front the
Refreshments, and now he's the lead singer of the Peacemakers.  He's
got the balance... he's not well-known, no.  The Peacemakers will
probably never sell out an arena, nope, and they may well never go
platinum, if they even go gold.
But they're based in Tempe, and can come all the way to Philadelphia,
and they can pull out a handful of people who can sing all the words to
every song they play.  They had the #1 independent album in America
for a long time.  They have no distribution.  No marketing, no
promotion, no slick publicity to back 'em up.  All Roger Clyne has is
his guitar, his voice, and his sincerity.

Who was it Stephen King quoted?  "Let the critics say what they will. 
I've never lied.  I've never truckled."

I dunno.  Sorry to be not-so-coherent about it.  It's something I
wonder about a lot, because of my own hopes for the future, I think.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1799 of 1922: But honestly--what kind of gas mileage can you expect at Mach 3, anyway? (tinymonster) Fri 9 Apr 04 10:15
    
I hear the conflict discussed so often in the realm of music; it's
interesting to hear it from a writer's perspective.  Love the King
quote-of-a-quote.
  
inkwell.vue.169 : Neil Gaiman's Signal in the Noise
permalink #1800 of 1922: a slight twinge of guilt for (miss-mousey) Fri 9 Apr 04 19:51
    
dodge - nah, nothing so dramatic. It's just odd that a bunch of people
we don't really know and only see once every 3 years (at most) are
coming out of the woodwork to attend a wedding of people that they (for
all intents and purposes) don't know. And some of these people (on
boy's side) didn't go to boy's brother's wedding just a few years ago.
As for my family, it's just a matter of timing. Most of them seem to be
postponing trips by a day, or returning from them early, or just being
able to squeeze it in their schedules, to make it to the ceremony.
It's nice to be able to see them and all, but (boy and I being more the
one-on-one types) it would be nicer if they weren't all just showing
up right at the same place at the same time and making it impossible to
have a conversation because there will be too many people there.
*sigh. silly ceremonies.

It probably doesn't help that we live in SF. Some of the people flying
in are making a big weekend/holiday out of it by playing tourists
around The City. I really think a couple of them might have said 'no'
if we lived in... oh, I dunno... <name of some small town in> Nebraska.

And it's supposed to say 'they're' up there, not 'their'. Stupid
posting when not thinking. ;P

In other news, I got my hair done today and it's all pretty. :) And
sitting next to me and chatting away with me almost the whole time was
Ted Naifeh (who writes a comic book called Courtney Crumrin). Neat. But
now I'm feeling bad for never having picked up one of his books -
especially when I described what I like about certain stories and I
basically described his book. Guess I know what's next on my reading
list at work.

Okay, going now. Kitty keeps hitting keys on the keyboard and clicking
buttons on the mouse... kinda hard to edit this as I go.

Oh, and I like the bit about freebasing story. :)

-squeaks
who is more of a "And Justice For All" girl, but then, I'm not a big
fan of Metallica to begin with.
  

More...



Members: Enter the conference to participate. All posts made in this conference are world-readable.

Subscribe to an RSS 2.0 feed of new responses in this topic RSS feed of new responses

 
   Join Us
 
Home | Learn About | Conferences | Member Pages | Mail | Store | Services & Help | Password | Join Us

Twitter G+ Facebook