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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #76 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Fri 16 Jun 23 11:40
permalink #76 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Fri 16 Jun 23 11:40
Not at bookstores. Yesterday I did a Zoom talk for the Museum of the San Ramon Valley; they say the recording will be online next week. I did an hour's podcast with a pair of geologists last month: <https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-geology-of-oakland-andrew-alden- author-of-deep-oakland/id1528861092> I was on KPFA a few weeks back: <https://kpfa.org/episode/upfront- may-17-2023/> And The Oaklandside visited the Hayward fault with me recently: <https://oaklandside.org/2023/05/26/oakland-deep-geology-hayward-fault/> Upcoming, I'll be addressing the local chapter of the Groundwater Resources Association of California next week: <https://www.grac.org/events/511/> And the Northern California Geological Society -- my pals! -- a week later: <https://www.ncgeolsoc.org> And that's it until a thing at the Oakland Library in September.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #77 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Fri 16 Jun 23 13:07
permalink #77 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Fri 16 Jun 23 13:07
I should add that <sumac>'s praise is especially welcome coming from a fellow published author.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #78 of 124: Frako Loden (frako) Fri 16 Jun 23 13:27
permalink #78 of 124: Frako Loden (frako) Fri 16 Jun 23 13:27
Former buildings in Piedmont: <https://piedmonthistorical.org/2015/06> Blair Quarries (not the same as Blair's Quarry): <https://oaklandgeology.com/2021/12/06/blair-quarries-not-the-same-as- blairs-quarry/>
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #79 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Fri 16 Jun 23 14:19
permalink #79 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Fri 16 Jun 23 14:19
Thanks for that, Frako. One thing I did, speaking of how to present geology, was to use my blog posts as places to learn more -- I listed a couple dozen in the endnotes. It's so easy to go online to pursue an interesting point; it's how I have come to read books, and I'm not alone. And in the e-edition of DEEP OAKLAND, those links are all live. I tried to make the book as contemporary as I knew how, even as my publisher, Heyday Books, is a straight-up print house without an audiobook option. In the endnotes I also said, straight out, that "I cite specific sources for advanced material, leaving more basic topics to the usual reputable websites." It doesn't serve the reader any more to point them to a physical library to consult a printed book, precious though those are.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #80 of 124: David Gans (tnf) Sat 17 Jun 23 12:48
permalink #80 of 124: David Gans (tnf) Sat 17 Jun 23 12:48
I agree with <sumac> about the beautiful writing! I'm still reading...
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #81 of 124: With catlike tread (sumac) Sat 17 Jun 23 20:29
permalink #81 of 124: With catlike tread (sumac) Sat 17 Jun 23 20:29
What was involved in becoming able to think in geological time? ("Nothing is permanent to a geologist.") Was there a time when it clicked for you, or has it been more like developing muscles?
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #82 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Sun 18 Jun 23 11:41
permalink #82 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Sun 18 Jun 23 11:41
It's not natural to think or live in geological time, and it isn't something, as far as I can tell, that just clicks. It's definitely a learning process, like developing muscles. I think it's more like developing flexibility, stretching those mental tendons. I think we just learn how fast things happen -- erosion, uplift, seismic displacement, plate movements, organic evolution, diffusion and mixing -- and sit with that knowledge. Without numbers, deep time is unfathomable. The history of geology shows that. James Hutton, the Scottish thinker who most effectively spread the idea of deep time, could only say that Earth's history appeared endless, and when Lord Kelvin argued that the Earth could be no older than 50 million years based on the physics of cooling solids, the geologists could only demur that as far as they could tell too much history had gone on to fit in that stretch. Today geologists have an intricate framework of time that includes the history of the planet, the history of life and the pace of geologic processes. It's our language. Without it, we're in the same visionary, mythic deep universe that preliterate humans lived in. I'm not sure anyone really grasps deep time, but at least we can measure it and our minds can operate in it.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #83 of 124: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Sun 18 Jun 23 13:25
permalink #83 of 124: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Sun 18 Jun 23 13:25
The means we use to understand earth processes and earth history is actualism. We look at things we see happening now* and we and we look for the effects of the same or similar processes as they are recorded in the rock record. Once we see what process causes an effect we can begin to measure how fast the process works and use this understanding to measure time. When I was in grade school I learned that mountains are created by some sort of uplift and they're worn down by erosion, and that the Appalachian Mountains near where I grew up were low and rounded because the range was old. Today I would talk about this as a competition between the rate at which mountains are uplifted and the rate at which they're eroded. The Appalachians are at a passive continental margin where they aren't being uplifted any more, so the rate of erosion wins the contest. These rates are invisible until we understand the processes and they're incomprehensible until we think in geologic time.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #84 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Sun 18 Jun 23 14:16
permalink #84 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Sun 18 Jun 23 14:16
I point out in chapter 9 that until the 20th century, all geologists had to work with were relative ages of rocks -- Cambrian, Devonian, Miocene and so on -- based fundamentally on the history of life as recorded in fossils and the vertical sequence of rocks that established the order of events. That was something, but as of 1900 "deep time" was a blurry procession of ages without dates that allowed us to order the sedimentary rocks with fossils, but left all other rocks in a poorly determined place on the timeline. Today we can confidently navigate deep time because since 1900 we've devised several good methods to determine real dates, expressed in real years, which enabled us to calibrate the fossil timeline and extend it all the way back to very near Earth's beginning. Actualism is the principle underlying all of that progress since the beginnings of geology in the 1600s. It holds, in a nutshell, that we aren't allowed to call upon miracles to explain the past, only causes we know for sure are natural. Actualism is an axiom, more than a research methodology.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #85 of 124: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Sun 18 Jun 23 15:41
permalink #85 of 124: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Sun 18 Jun 23 15:41
Actualism is what allows us to thread a path between uniformitarianism and catastrophism. We can see evidence of catastrophes in Earth's past against the backdrop of the results of steady uniform processes. This includes catastrophes of types we've never seen or at scales we've never seen, like the Chicxulub meteor strike or the Lake Missoula floods.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #86 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Sun 18 Jun 23 16:42
permalink #86 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Sun 18 Jun 23 16:42
All we did was expand the definition of "natural" as the evidence grew. As Playfair wrote about Hutton's research, "we became sensible how much further reason may sometimes go than imagination may venture to follow."
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #87 of 124: With catlike tread (sumac) Sun 18 Jun 23 16:50
permalink #87 of 124: With catlike tread (sumac) Sun 18 Jun 23 16:50
Thanks for that. I word I now need to figure out how to use in daily life: quaquaversal.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #88 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Sun 18 Jun 23 16:56
permalink #88 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Sun 18 Jun 23 16:56
I tried to drop a cool word into every chapter, some more useful than others.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #89 of 124: Mary Mazzocco (mazz) Sun 18 Jun 23 18:19
permalink #89 of 124: Mary Mazzocco (mazz) Sun 18 Jun 23 18:19
You are famous on the Well for a couple things: one is your collection of pavement markers, the other is for walking pretty much everywhere. Do both of these hobbies tie back into geology?
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #90 of 124: Scott Underwood (esau) Sun 18 Jun 23 20:16
permalink #90 of 124: Scott Underwood (esau) Sun 18 Jun 23 20:16
I admire both those pastimes. I don't go for long walks nearly enough, but whenever I go I note the sidewalk badges. I was having lunch in Berkeley with a new friend and I learned her grandfather had poured a lot of sidewalks. Her last name is Doty and sure enough, I see him often!
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #91 of 124: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Sun 18 Jun 23 20:29
permalink #91 of 124: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Sun 18 Jun 23 20:29
<alden> I love your book because you so freely share your opinions of the way Oakland has been developed and because it's so clear how much you love being surrounded by Oakland and by its geology. And because the book is so well written!
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #92 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Mon 19 Jun 23 11:01
permalink #92 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Mon 19 Jun 23 11:01
The sidewalk stamps thing (see https://oaklandunderfoot.com/) began when I started accompanying my wife on her morning trek to work in Berkeley in an attempt to get more exercise. I'd go partway with her, then return home by alternate routes, and there were so many stamps! But the whole thing truly originated in my youthful passion of coin collecting. It was about that time when I finally dispersed my collection, and the blog arose as a way to record sidewalk stamps the same way I used to collect coins: find and document a stamp from each year that a maker was in business. That's how I learned about classic masons like Ed Doty (https://oaklandunderfoot.com/2017/07/14/sidewalk-maker-ed-doty/) and Frank Salamid (https://oaklandunderfoot.com/2016/08/26/sidewalk-maker-frank- salamid/) and J. H. Fitzmaurice (https://oaklandunderfoot.com/2017/03/03/sidewalk-maker-j-h-fitzmaurice/). I set out to survey the entire city of Oakland, every block, both sides. That took almost ten years, and in the process I learned the city's terrain in intimate detail, including the good outcrops and localities. I also got really good at walking and using the buses and BART to get around, because I enjoyed the experience more than driving. Finally, it got me into researching Oakland's past. That familiarity with Ancestry.com and Newspapers.com and the Internet Archive paid off even more than I dreamed when the pandemic struck while I was writing DEEP OAKLAND.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #93 of 124: Inkwell Host (jonl) Mon 19 Jun 23 12:06
permalink #93 of 124: Inkwell Host (jonl) Mon 19 Jun 23 12:06
We scheduled this discussion through June 19, today, so we're technically at the end of the two week commitment was requested from our guest. But it's fine to continue the discussion, the topic will remain open. This is also where we step in to thank <alden>, <mazz>, and all the other participants for the great and informative conversation. Reminder that you can find the book _Deep Oakland_ in various bookstores, including Bookshop.org <https://bookshop.org/a/52607/9781597145961>. It's published by HeyDay Books: <https://www.heydaybooks.com/catalog/deep-oakland/>.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #94 of 124: With catlike tread (sumac) Mon 19 Jun 23 12:34
permalink #94 of 124: With catlike tread (sumac) Mon 19 Jun 23 12:34
Thank you!
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #95 of 124: Mary Mazzocco (mazz) Mon 19 Jun 23 12:52
permalink #95 of 124: Mary Mazzocco (mazz) Mon 19 Jun 23 12:52
Thanks, Andrew! As I said elsewell, I can't say enough good things about your book. But I'm trying, I'm trying!
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #96 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Mon 19 Jun 23 13:18
permalink #96 of 124: Andrew Alden (alden) Mon 19 Jun 23 13:18
I'm always here to keep talking about my book. Thanks for your compliments, and for paying attention to begin with. I continue to take long walks for the pleasurable exercise, to revisit Oakland's geological features, and to find more stuff underfoot. I plan to keep it up -- and sunbathe by Lake Merritt -- for the rest of my life.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #97 of 124: Axon (axon) Mon 19 Jun 23 14:06
permalink #97 of 124: Axon (axon) Mon 19 Jun 23 14:06
As entertaining and knowledgeable a discussion as this program gets. Thanks, Andrew and Mary for making it happen.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #98 of 124: Alan Fletcher : Factual accounts are occluded by excess of interpretation (af) Mon 19 Jun 23 14:10
permalink #98 of 124: Alan Fletcher : Factual accounts are occluded by excess of interpretation (af) Mon 19 Jun 23 14:10
Great interviews ... tho I haven't read the book, and don't know Oakland much beyond Jack London Square. Might buy it as a christmas gift for a marine geologist I know (though she's segued back from bay-area groundwater to to marine biology).
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #99 of 124: Eric Rawlins (woodman) Mon 19 Jun 23 14:18
permalink #99 of 124: Eric Rawlins (woodman) Mon 19 Jun 23 14:18
Great topic. Thanks to all involved.
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Andrew Alden - Deep Oakland: How Geology Shaped a City
permalink #100 of 124: Jordan is Puffball! (magdalen) Mon 19 Jun 23 14:38
permalink #100 of 124: Jordan is Puffball! (magdalen) Mon 19 Jun 23 14:38
so interesting! thanks, alden.
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