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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #426 of 578: William F. Stockton (yesway) Sun 10 Nov 24 22:07
permalink #426 of 578: William F. Stockton (yesway) Sun 10 Nov 24 22:07
Just remember these two(no comfort, sorry). "When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - HST "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." - PKD
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #427 of 578: David Turoff (condorito) Sun 10 Nov 24 23:10
permalink #427 of 578: David Turoff (condorito) Sun 10 Nov 24 23:10
Im just so disappointed in Homo sapiens A species remarkably Ill-adapted for long term survival, likely to be functionally extinct in a few hundred years, though full biological extinction of a species with global distribution may take somewhat longer.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #428 of 578: David Turoff (condorito) Sun 10 Nov 24 23:11
permalink #428 of 578: David Turoff (condorito) Sun 10 Nov 24 23:11
* ill* adapted
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #429 of 578: Michael Newman (jstrawtoo) Mon 11 Nov 24 05:28
permalink #429 of 578: Michael Newman (jstrawtoo) Mon 11 Nov 24 05:28
I'm having a sort of Roddy Piper in "They Live" experience. I line in a time and place where most people had the choice between a public servant and a self-dealer who revels in his monstrosity, and they chose the latter. This IS who the collective-we, are. By 2017 I could no longer stand the sight or sound of the guy. I couldn't stand the site or sound of cartoonists illustrating and commenting on him, actors portraying him, or comedians parodying him. I can only absorb the horrors he wreaks, filtered through text. I'm in ostrich mode for the moment. I'm not sure I can cope unless I keep him and what he's about to do, as removed from my mind to the greatest extent I can manage. I'm not at all certain that I can continue to be a high information voter and carry on. My instinct is to express my values by being an asset to my local community and let the nation go to the devil, if that's its choice. I don't know how I'll feel in one month or six. I don't know how I'll feel once anticipated horrors become our lived reality. I feel hopeless, helpless, and a bit ashamed of myself. There is a grey mist that feels like it can't lift, and perhaps shouldn't.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #430 of 578: Ari Davidow (ari) Mon 11 Nov 24 06:14
permalink #430 of 578: Ari Davidow (ari) Mon 11 Nov 24 06:14
Others have said it. This _is_ depressing. It could be as bad as we fear, and the last American "free and fair" election (to the incomplete degree that it aspired in that direction). We do need to take time to take care of ourselves. But, ultimately, it is about changing the stories. Biden-Harris gave us a glimpse of a much better path forward, in action. Bernie and Warren are still here. AOC is still here. The important thing is to get back to local organizing. When people can see themselves make a difference, they change. Elections aren't really won at the national level - they're won when the local stuff drives the States drives the nation. If our locals aren't seeing their communities, if they vote, they vote for themselves and their perceived tribe. It's not the first time we've been kicked in the teeth. It's going to take a lot of work to maybe get another chance after this one. But, first, we need some time to take care of ourselves.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #431 of 578: Ari Davidow (ari) Mon 11 Nov 24 06:29
permalink #431 of 578: Ari Davidow (ari) Mon 11 Nov 24 06:29
At an event I attended last night, reference was made to the group "Waging Non-violence": "The key to taking effective action in a Trump world is to avoid perpetuating the autocrats goals of fear, isolation, exhaustion and disorientation." https://wagingnonviolence.org/
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #432 of 578: Inkwell Co-Host (jonl) Mon 11 Nov 24 06:58
permalink #432 of 578: Inkwell Co-Host (jonl) Mon 11 Nov 24 06:58
That organization has an excellent set of recommendations going forward, at a link Larry posted in <363> and that I had posted elsewhere: <https://wagingnonviolence.org/2024/11/10-things-to-do-if-trump-wins/>
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #433 of 578: Jennifer Powell (jnfr) Mon 11 Nov 24 07:25
permalink #433 of 578: Jennifer Powell (jnfr) Mon 11 Nov 24 07:25
I found this article useful, especially this paragraph: "People too often think hope is smiles and sunshine, when its fury in the face of danger and oppression, and pressing on in the storm." Rebecca Solnit Authoritarians like Trump love fear, defeatism, surrender. Do not give them what they want <https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/nov/09/authoritarians-like-trump-love-f ear-defeatism-surrender-do-not-give-them-what-they-want>
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #434 of 578: a (coiro) Mon 11 Nov 24 11:56
permalink #434 of 578: a (coiro) Mon 11 Nov 24 11:56
I'm a little more open to pieces like that than I was immediately after the tragedy. I know that's what people who write think pieces do; they jump in and offer what they can. But I wasn't ready to hear anything then, really. This I'll read. Today is probably a shit day for the most tentative to choose to peek out - what with Stephen Miller poised to join the kill unit. If I weren't already out of that mode, this would chase me right back in. Sunday's geeze* was a truly healing experience - some two dozen Wellbeings enjoying just being in the same space, a lot of us talking about how to best improve the world in ways that we can still fathom in this moment. I left feeling renewed. Not to where I was pre-election when we still had hope, but better. In the spirit of what we were doing in the Before - door-knocking, sending texts, donating money - what are you doing or thinking of doing that might make things a bit better? I'm looking into helping out on a crisis phone line. The obligation is 15 hours of training, then 4 hours a week, a total 200 hour commitment. I think I can handle that. What about you? *For those reading from outside, a "geeze" is a Bay Area-born series of gatherings that's spreading into other places, too. A real joy to see each other in real spaces.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #435 of 578: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Mon 11 Nov 24 12:00
permalink #435 of 578: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Mon 11 Nov 24 12:00
(It's a short form of "Geezers Getting Coffee". Unrelated to other usage of "geeze".)
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #436 of 578: Emily Gertz (emilyg) Mon 11 Nov 24 14:14
permalink #436 of 578: Emily Gertz (emilyg) Mon 11 Nov 24 14:14
>I think Bernie Sanders would have beat Trump in a general election. Setting aside Biden hanging on and no competitive Democratic primary process and Harris having barely three months to run a year's worth of campaign: My response is that broadly speaking, class alone does not explain this election's annihilation of the center-left. Bernie's a strict marxist in excluding racism and misogyny from his analysis. He's far from the only one. Biden has unequivocally supported unions. His administration has been the most anti-trust in generations. The IRA will create (would have created?) 10s of thousands of good working class jobs. So will/would the CHIPS act. Republicans have made no secret of wanting to gut them both, whether or not that actually happens. Were millions and millions of working class voters this dumb? Or are there other factors involved here?
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #437 of 578: William F. Stockton (yesway) Mon 11 Nov 24 15:32
permalink #437 of 578: William F. Stockton (yesway) Mon 11 Nov 24 15:32
>> Were millions and millions of working class voters this dumb? Absolutely. Kamala and Tim should have driven a Monster Truck over a mound of flaming copies of Project 2025, followed by John Cena riding in on a Longhorn Bull carrying a When We Fight - We Win! flag. I meant Bernie could have beat Trump in 2016, unless Wall Street focused on crushing him. He had a real populist agenda/message that was getting real traction. I think he could have belittled Trump to great effect in front of crowds of young people. He knows how to express anger in public. He could have goaded the TV host into apoplexy. Well never know, but I think it would have been worth trying. I knew how much my low info right winger relatives loathed HRC. I didnt commit to her candidacy until Jerry Brown endorsed her. I still had reservations based on my own observations of RW culture, but I figured he knew better. My family has been active in Democratic politics in California for 150 years. Many were/are public servants. Ive been working for the party faithfully since the Mondale campaign. Im afraid the party has become too much an enterprise with its own interests, and not a vehicle for advancing an agenda that serves the constituency. It has been co-opted.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #438 of 578: Celia Chapman (lark) Mon 11 Nov 24 15:51
permalink #438 of 578: Celia Chapman (lark) Mon 11 Nov 24 15:51
I'm in ostrich mode for now but will come out soon. I think it's important to bear witness, to help how we can, and to know what is being done. Not paying attention will help bad things happen. I don't know yet what I'll get involved with but I plan to find something.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #439 of 578: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Mon 11 Nov 24 17:45
permalink #439 of 578: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Mon 11 Nov 24 17:45
Bernie hadn't built relationships with nationwide Democratic constituencies the way Clinton had. He didn't have a chance.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #440 of 578: Ron Levin (eclectic2) Mon 11 Nov 24 18:33
permalink #440 of 578: Ron Levin (eclectic2) Mon 11 Nov 24 18:33
Plus, he's an old, Jewish socialist with no legislative legacy despite decades in Congress. I don't know how that would've played. I love Bernie. And I agree he'd have made a far more dynamic candidate.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #441 of 578: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Mon 11 Nov 24 18:36
permalink #441 of 578: Virtual Sea Monkey (karish) Mon 11 Nov 24 18:36
Not a very good president, though. The ideas he brought us were/are very important.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #442 of 578: William F. Stockton (yesway) Mon 11 Nov 24 18:59
permalink #442 of 578: William F. Stockton (yesway) Mon 11 Nov 24 18:59
He might have been a weak president, but Trump would be selling steaks, and doing crooked development deals.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #443 of 578: Jef Poskanzer (jef) Mon 11 Nov 24 21:56
permalink #443 of 578: Jef Poskanzer (jef) Mon 11 Nov 24 21:56
My dirt-simple model of the Americal electorate is: if they are unhappy, they vote against the incumbent party. That's it. They don't care that the challenger will obviously make them much more unhappy. They don't care that the numbers show the incumbent party has been improving things. They don't care that a lot of their unhappiness coms from lies told by the challenger. None of that matters. In this model, the only candidate who had a chance of making the electorate happy was Harris. And when she started, shouting her message of joy, her poll numbers went up up up. If she had stuck with that message, and talked about tangible things that the voters actually want, she'd have won in a landslide.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #444 of 578: Elizabeth Churchill (leroyleroy) Tue 12 Nov 24 04:24
permalink #444 of 578: Elizabeth Churchill (leroyleroy) Tue 12 Nov 24 04:24
>If she had stuck with that message, and talked about tangible things that the voters actually want, she'd have won in a landslide. That makes sense, but only if the voters had been able to actually hear her message. Which most didnt because 100% of their news and information came from a steady diet of Fox News, Newsmax, One America, Sinclair, Christian radio, Xitter, Joe Rogan and other right wing podcasts, etc. They probably had no idea she was shouting a message of joy, or any clue what her policies were. They just believed whatever lies they were told about her and that was all they knew.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #445 of 578: William F. Stockton (yesway) Tue 12 Nov 24 08:27
permalink #445 of 578: William F. Stockton (yesway) Tue 12 Nov 24 08:27
Large numbers of voters googled Did Biden drop out? on election day. Im tellin ya, its an Idiocracy. Kamala needed to drive Monster Trucks into stadiums, and make videos of her leading drum lines. She needed to go on podcasts and say lots of rude things about TFG. Nice and reasonable is a losing strategy. Maybe a Lucha Libre tag team match between her and Walz, and a couple of Trump/Vance types. Bread and circuses. Thats the ticket.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #446 of 578: Larry Person (lperson) Tue 12 Nov 24 08:36
permalink #446 of 578: Larry Person (lperson) Tue 12 Nov 24 08:36
Except Black women don't get to say rude things because then they'll be angry and that makes no sense because how angry does Donald Trump need to be (or act) before people talk about angry, corrupt, entitled, white sociopathic malignant narcissist?
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #447 of 578: Jennifer Powell (jnfr) Tue 12 Nov 24 08:53
permalink #447 of 578: Jennifer Powell (jnfr) Tue 12 Nov 24 08:53
Yes, a red news bubble that's almost impossible to infiltrate, and a multiracial female candidate, you don't need more than that.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #448 of 578: @allartburns@mastodon.social @liberalgunsmith@defcon.social (jet) Tue 12 Nov 24 10:15
permalink #448 of 578: @allartburns@mastodon.social @liberalgunsmith@defcon.social (jet) Tue 12 Nov 24 10:15
<jef> pretty much describes the senate race in PA, as if the senator's position could directly change local economics.
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #449 of 578: a (coiro) Tue 12 Nov 24 11:24
permalink #449 of 578: a (coiro) Tue 12 Nov 24 11:24
President-elect Donald Trump announced Tuesday he is nominating former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee as U.S. ambassador to Israel. The decision lines up another staunch ally of Israel for Trumps incoming administration, after he announced Monday he would appoint Rep. Elise Stefanik (R-New York) to be U.S. ambassador to the United Nations. Trump ran for president promising to wind down overseas conflicts, including the war in Gaza that broke out after Hamas attacked Israel last year. <https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/11/12/trump-administration-transi tion/#link-P7DRD7XFMFGQJFXAUC2MX325UI>
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Angie Coiro and Friends: Election 2024
permalink #450 of 578: Robin Thomas (robin) Tue 12 Nov 24 12:23
permalink #450 of 578: Robin Thomas (robin) Tue 12 Nov 24 12:23
By winding it down I understood him to mean flattening and handing over the beachfront property to his son-in-law.
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